|Posted by JPL on 2005/10/22 10:14:33
|After, 10 month of mapping, and 1218 hours and 38 minutes of fullvis process (yes you read it correctly, it's equal to 50 days 18 h 38 mn), I'm glad to present my last map.
CDA has been started last year for the 1000-Brushes Winter contest, but due to the birth of my second daughter, I missed the delivery date, and I turn the map into a bigger project... It is based on the DKT3 texture set, but with much more brushes... :D
I also would like to rise here some little issues:
-> In order to play the map correctly without any problem, you can use aguirRe's engine.
-> FitzQuake 0.80 (or equivalent engine) may have packet overflow warnings if the progression through the map is too fast, and if you don't try to kill all the monsters... i.e speedrunners please use aguirRe's engine... sorry for this...
-> Standard Quake engine will not be able to load the map, so forget it..
You can download the stuff at my website http://lambert.jeanphilippe.free.fr/Quake/Quake.htm and don't forget to read the test file please.. ;P
Ooops, I was about to forget to thank aguirRe, Hrimfaxi, R.P.G and Scragbait for beta testing, technical support, interesting discussion, etc.. etc... and for all the support you gave me these last months...
You all rock men.. Thanks a lot again..
Too Much Ammo
There is such a thing as a small ammo box, you know :-)
All monsters (177 iirc)
Played through again on hard and got al monsters again but the same to secrets, but I made the mistake of throwing a quad grenade at a vore I was standing next to so I lost all of my armour and ended up with just 2 health.
What was the custom progs.dat needed for?
PulSar / ZBRAEKER / Scragbait / Lardarse
PulSar: read #36 for SNG clue ;) And thanks for the feedback
ZBREAKER: I'm glad it ran fine on "old celeron 1.4GHz" some people experimented low FPS, but with slower PC.. I guess CPU running at 1GHz at least is able to support the map...
Scragbait: I reply your email.. ;P... And for sure I will ask you for a next map beta test :) Thanks a lot for your help on this project, you rock ! BTW, the screensaver idea is cool ;P
Lardarse: Custom progs.dat is based on the spawn64 progs.dat. When you progress in the map, you trig monsters, and then you avoid packet overflow/edicts count issues.
Having all the monsters present ingame from the start of the map (regardless of the additionnal teleporters need, etc...), was not usefull: the map would have contained too much entities and may also generate edicts count problems..
so, just try to play the map killing as less as possible monsters and you will experiment massive packet overflow with FitzQuake very soon.. That's the reason of the existence of this progs.dat.
BTW, thanks a lot to aguirRe who provided me the file ;)
I also know small ammo pack, but I clearly know that most of the player are for sure more experimented and good as I was expecting... so it will be much more diffcult next time... believe me... o_O... OTOH, replay the map in hard, missing the secret, and I guess it will be another story ;) Let me know if it's more challenging then...
JPL / ArguirRe
JPL: It was still a nice level, and I liked the SSG practice on the various different monsters.
aguirRe: Would it be possible for you to send me the spawn64 source code? Playing this level has gven me an idea, and I don't know exactly which parts of the Zerst�rer source I need.
I've uploaded the files (based on the original QC 1.06) here: http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k/spawn64_src.7z
Build with proqcc 1.60. Please let me know when you've grabbed it.
This should be fun...
*Cough* 30 fps is bloody fine.
30 fps is not fine... come on man, be serious. This is Quake. The game was released in 1996. I better get 72 solid, or I'm gonna have a dummy spit! :D
30 fps might be borderline acceptable if the game and map are both superawesome, but, for me at least, its certainly not 'fine'.
Having said that, as long as I get 72 fps on my PC, I don't really give a shit. I don't know what the poly count was on this map, and I didn't need to check, because it ran nice and smoothly in FQ... so I have no need to complain!
Last time I checked, knights and ogres don't bunnyhop around you whilst popping off 180-degree mid-air rockets.
No, they don't... but I do. :D
Part of why I really enjoyed this map is because I was able to do just that. The items provided, monster placement and space gave me the freedom to dance around and use my deathmatch skills to dispense my enemies in style.
Wouldn't have been nearly as much fun with a bad frame rate. I guess its worth noting though that 30fps constant actually might be ok for single player... the real problem is extreme fluctuation in the frame rate (i.e. if its jumping from 30 to 60 to 10 to 40 or whatever).
If you do have a bad framerate, perhaps you can try capping your max fps to your average frame rate... is this possible in FQ?
The map has been built with 6857 brushes...
After TxQBSP process I had:
35183 marksurfaces (exceed the 32767 max limit)
35183 marksurfaces (exceed the 32767 max limit)
It makes me want to add another one (final) area to my map.
So, where were the other 2 secrets?
Where is the fun if I give you the clues for the secrets ?
If you really want the clue for all secrets, send me an email ;P
... no seriously, I was joking... here are the secrets location:
- 1st secret is hidden under in the first water part. You have to shot the side "stained-glass" light of the grey bridge wall, the light will switch off, and the underwater secret is open: you will find a MH
- 2nd secret is in the 2nd cemeterry: there is a "little house", shot the door, you will find a YA
- 3rd secret is located in the church, behind the huge blue stained-glass windows "rosace"... When you re-enter the church on the 1st floor, (there are some HK there), shot the left part of the wall in front of the entry, an hidden door will open, and you can enter in a small area hidden by the 2 blue stained-glass windows: you will find there healths and ammos.
- 4th secret, the entry is in the Castle, under the platform where the command button of stair bars is located. This entry (closed by 4 little metal bar) is opened when pushing the church button (on the first floor). You will find healths, ammos and RA.
Now I have to remember to avoid reading your post, as I never found all secrets (1 to go). Will be looking harder on my next run through
This Map Is Awesome
Wow. This is a really really well done map JPL! I've never been happier that someone didn't finish a map on time...what a waste it would have been to stop at 1000 brushes!
Curvy, awesome architecture, with well done "castle feel"
Excellent rocks and terrain throughout
Lots of neat trick jumps with the buttresses and other angled parts
Big size, with tons of varied battles and enemies.
The blue fog was really well done...subtle...and certainly added to the feel of the map.
Felt a bit too arena-ish...there was some verticality certainly, but the way that the castle was setup, you sort of don't feel the sense of interwoven z-axis. Kinn's map was like this too, and I guess you can't really avoid it considering the scale. So it's not really a "con" I guess, just a differint style of gameplay.
Awesome map that everyone should play.
Too much ammo! I had like 20+ rockets left over at the end on hard...and was never close to being out of ammo.
Too much ammo! I had like 20+ rockets left over at the end on hard...and was never close to being out of ammo.
Goes under cons, not under overall!
Also "a different style"
a pity i didn't have a chance to do this earlier.
i hope i can somehow manage to get this thing to my pc at home - maybe i'll try one of these ancient little plastic squares people used to store their data on in the last century... ;)
(i hope i still have a drive somewhere around)
buy a cheap usb stick.
Well, as the zipped file is 3.34 MB, I guess you will have to split the files in several part and use 3 floppy disks at least...
OTOH, there are some old PCs (sorted before 1996... my parents have on elike this..) which have no USB plug...
So I really think you have to buy an new PC... though... ;P
zipped it might be three disks, rarred it fits perfectly (on 1,5).
bambuz, i wanted to buy one a couple of weeks ago, but they are still too expensive compared to their memory size, so i think i'll go for a cheap mp3/usb 512mb solution soon...
JPL, I am very impressed!
I enjoyed playing this map and I will definitely play it again a few times. The end battle was quite tough because I picked up the Quad too early (skill 2). The progress in the level was ok, I got lost after I found the GK. I felt quite lost a couple of times but it was ok. The architecture is wonderful, I loved that "notredame" thingies outside (ask if you're not sure what I mean). The monster placement and balance was great even though I often did not see a monster before it attacked me (see below). The flame/torch thingies (I should more architectural words) looked a bit artificial when there were few brushes/low polywork around them, but that's totally minor. The various buildings each had a total unique gameplay/feeling which I liked very much.
(I should write down things while I play, there was much more but I forgot it...)
What I did not like were the textures. Not for their overall look and atmosphere (which was great, even though I played without fog... Stupid me...). But for their washed out and totally "monster-hiding" colors! That's at least one point that made Daikatana a flop :D
I made a demo at the second try. First I died at the SK, then I tried with skill 2 again and recorded. About 25 minutes and a death at the end battle... Enjoy :)
I'd give you about 7-8/10 stars. The textures and the very open layout were negative aspects for me. But a quality map overall! I'm looking forward for what comes next :)
The flame/torch thingies (I should know more architectural words) looked . . .
As long as you don't make a habit of calling everything a buttress even when those things are not supporting any other structures, you will do fine.
I wondered about your answer first, it sounded quite sarcastic to me until I looked up buttress in a dictionary. Mmmmhh, what a nice word :)
Thanks for your feedback: I'm glad you globally enjoyed the map ;) And also thanks a lot for the rating (i.e I'd give you about 7-8/10 stars).. And I have to agree with you when you said the texture are washed out and have totally "monster-hiding" colors... It was the first comments coming from beta-tests... And I had to fight a lot with lightning effects to compensate this issue... Thought the DKT textures were not designed for Quake, so it could explain this weird feeling...
In anyway, I would like to thank all the people who played the map, and gave comments here.
I also woul like to thank again aguirRe, RPG, Scragbait and Hrimfaxi for all the precious advices and supports given during this project. As I already said, I was not expecting so much good comments, and I guess without the help they provided me, the results would have been completlty different, and for sure not so good... you all rock guys !
Finally Played It, Too!
impressive map, indeed!
again, i haven't read the other posts of this thread, but i'll just post my thoughts regardless if it has been said dozens of times already:
the scale was great (concerning open places/outside areas) - this created not only a certain feeling of exploration (at least in the first few minutes), it always also let one new or rather unnoticed monster suddenly appear from some direction, so one had to keep his eyes open all the time.
the fog and the overall dismal light fit very well, as they produced a special kind of atmosphere in combination with the textures (i liked them a lot, btw.), and also made it harder to spot the monsters and their attacks, which created some tricky situations for me a couple of times.
i found the church to look particulary good somehow and the mountains surrounding the castle were awesome, too!
the sound disappeared a few times in the beginning, but that wasn't a big deal, especially since you mentioned it in the text file. the lava texture, however, looked mandelbrotly ugly (fruit loops again), it didn't fit with the rest of the set - you should have used one like the q3a lava, for example.
the exit could have been done better, as well, just a black wall isn't a good solution. why didn't you just make one of the regular passages into darkness, with a negative light maybe?
the onscreen messages looked a litte strange with all words capitalized.
by and large, as i said, an excellent map with good gameplay (although there could have been more monsters, of course, as there was much more ammo than needed). 2/4 secrets, ~30 minutes.
so thanks for that one.
I played this a while ago but never got around to commenting on it.
My first impression (which remains valid still) is WOW. I really liked the ambitious and outdoor layout. I know that Quake started as hallways and rooms, but I really love maps that try to get away from that. That's one of the reasons I thought that Scragbait's Estate was so cool - it consisted of actual buildings, not rooms giving the impression of buildings. Same thing here, I liked your use of real buildings and real outdoor areas. Being able to access the rooftops just made it even sweeter.
Second, in addition to the layout, I really enjoyed the theme. You chose an excellent texture set and applied it well with cool design ideas, as well as awesome touches like the banners in the key room or the gravestones. Little things like that make the map so much more immersive, and you did them well. The fog helped too.
The secret areas were good (I got two), and I enjoyed the gameplay throughout (played on hard). The way to go was almost always apparent, I got lost only once and for a short time only - basically never a dull moment.
Overall, what the map reminded me of, with its dark-medieval theme, sprawling, outdoor horizontal layout, and medieval details, is old Heretic or Hexen levels, but taken much further. I enjoyed it a lot, I'm glad you saw this through those incredible vis times. I say, make another just like it. But maybe bigger :)
Neg!ke / Tronyn
neg!ke: Thanks a lot for the comments, I'm glad you enjoyed the map. I noticed that you found the gameplay rather good, while in UWF review gameplay was rated as average (is it your review Tronyn ??), but I can easily understand some experimented players would have prefered to see much more monsters in a so "huge" map..
In anyway, my idea was much more to build something beautifull (in terms of architecture and layout), rather than having amount monsters to defeat, and then loose completely how the map looks... The limits about monsters number came obviously from engine, and also by the fact I'm not an expert in QC development... ;P .. Without aguirRe's spawn64 QC, the map would have been unplayable with standard engine, but only with aguirRe's engine.. A shame... And as you maybe noticed, I didn't sacrifice the gameplay at all !!!... otherwize the map woud have turned into DM !! :D
Tronyn: when you say .. make another just like it. But maybe bigger :) I guess I will try to take much more care about vis time for next project, and try to not fall down into stupid traps like "wide-open-area Quake map" ... Vis doesn't like it ! It was a real patience challenge to wait, with many doubts, saying to myself: "stop the process, or not stop the process..." that was the question (thanks William Shakespeare !!)... Well, in anyway, you will see me in the next months on func_ with an other project I started some weeks ago, based on DKT1/4 texture set...
Well, as I already said above, I thank everybody for all the comments I found here. I also would like to thank (again and again and again) aguirRe, Scragbait, RPG and Hrimfaxi for their support during the project: I guess the map would not have been soo good without their advices. You all rock !
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