... I'm trying to finish up a Coagula style level and want to use the sort of falling into void gibbing experience I received from ELEK in Coagula1. The experience involves being gibbed AND teleported high into the level. I've tried with various combinations of trigger_hurts and trigger_teleports but can't get the effect right. Anyone help? 

I believe all that's needed is to teleport two monsters to the same place at once. Telefragged goodness! 

... but I thought the player had priority in a telefrag fest i.e. that if the player and any number of monsters teleported to the same destination at the same time then the player survived but nothing else did.

I remember perceiving the series of events when I fell from structure in C1 as:
1. I'm gibbed
2. and almost immediately teleported high into the level

Not the other way round. 

I've seen that VIS reports entity number at the end of its log file. I had edict count problem in CMC map, so I just would like to know if there's any "direct" relation between entity number and edict counts ingame ?
In that case, what is this relation ? And so, can the VIS entity number report be helpfull in order not to exceed edict counts ingame ? 

mean the printout at the end of the Light log. AFAIK that figure is only an indication of how many edicts there are. Many edicts are created at startup and during gameplay and these are not included in that figure.

Example of temporary edicts are missiles from scrags or deathknights. You'll have to use the edictcount command or the new edict screen display of my upcoming engines.

The best way I know to provoke as many edicts as possible is to play on Nightmare, use god mode and play through the map without killing anything. Then the edicts will really pile up and then find a place where there are many scrags or deathknights and circle above them to provoke their missile attacks.

If you don't exceed 600 then, most likely your map is safe. 

My mistake! I thought you were just asking about making it rain gibs, not what you were asking about which I have no clue how it works :) 

Also, static lights do not count as edicts, so the entity count usually doesn't have much in common with the in-game edict count. 

So, how is it possible to determine "approximatively" edicts count, in order to anticipate and avoid crash ingame??
When I see Kinn latest release with an incredible amount of monsters (final battle for example), I'm guessing there for sure a method to determine edicts count. I tested Kinn's "Bastion of The UnderWorld" and "Marcher Fortress" with FitzQuake, and I had no problem, while in the same time I had the problem with my CMC map...(I reach the limit in hard skill..), but I don't find a good method to determine edicts count max value...
I know Kinn is talented (much much more than me...), but even if there are some "tips" in his 2 maps (due to QC I suppose), for common mortal I am, there is certainly a good method to evaluate edicts count in map.. Any idea ?? 

You can see how many edicts are being used in game by bringing down the console and typing 'edictcount'.

Also:
edicts - lists info about all the edicts
edict N - lists info about the Nth edict 

the famous 600 edict limit in normal engines, there's also another related issue; the server signon buffer size.

This typically becomes a problem when saving the game and then reloading it. If there are too many active edicts, the signon buffer will overflow and the engine aborts with the also famous SZ_GetSpace: ... error.

In my upcoming engine versions I've tried to improve this check so you'll get a warning when you exceed the normal limit. 

How much is too much? How could it be made more interesting? I just realized I've got quite a bit good 'ol backtracking action going on here. 

around the same general area would be excessive, unless you open areas up from new vistas or do neat Doom style room deformations then you could go maybe as many as twelve encircling routes. 

at http://user.tninet.se/~xir870k . All engines are updated with many features/fixes, e.g. more help to debug maps and reduced CPU load. RVis includes more ambient sound control and TreeQBSP has a minor fix. Please also see readmes for details.

Any comments are welcome. 

I get an error about fmod.dll. I have this file in the right place but nehahra will not start. 

thanks for info about the laser :) I should have known that by myself. 

Make sure you're using the fmod.dll from the Nehahra pack. Newer versions of this DLL (distributed by e.g. JoeQuake) is apparently not backwards compatible, i.e. there's a missing call entry. I wonder what reason they had for doing this ... 

That pretty much depends on the map and how it's implemented. As a vague rule, I'd say that backtracking for more than 1/3 of the entire map is probably a bad idea.

As mentioned Headthump, there are lots of things you can do to spice it up. Typical stuff is just spawning in a few monsters to surprise and toy with the player. For more varied and unique situations, you'd need to analyze what the player did before having to backtrack. Did he activate/deactivate a power grid? Maybe have that open some windows, turn off some lights, or activate some idle machinery. Are there balconeys the player can't get to? Maybe add a few scripted scenes for the player to watch; or perhaps have some lights flicker briefly as if there was a momentary lapse in power.

And if you're well and truly out of ideas, just make random things blow up and have pipes spew massive quantities of steam; that's always a thrill. 

If you truly did "just realize" how much backtracking the player needs to do, then you might consider opening up a few new alternate routes for the player to get back to the previous area. Maybe let him crawl up into a pipe or onto a catwalk and go view some of the map from a previous angle. 

Okay, that post was rather incoherent.

If you truly did "just realize" how much backtracking the player needs to do, then it's probably not too late to change the layout or route a little bit. Maybe let him crawl up into a pipe or onto a catwalk and go view some of the map from an angle that was previous inaccessible. This would also be fun for sniping on unsuspecting soldiers that have somehow re-filled the area. 

backtracking is ok as long as the gameplay changes significantly on each backtrack.

If a maps layout and architecture is OMG THE BEST EVER [like Insomnia for example], then backtracking can become "a wonderful thing" (TM), not just annoying. 

A working installer of Darkedit, an updated version of BSP has been found recently.

http://www.fileplanet.com/dl.aspx?/planetquake/elf/darkedit.zip 

Thanks! 

Well, um. I have three alternate routes through upper maintenance sector. But player still has to go through it twice. Maybe I'm just being overtly sensitive about backtracking. However, the idea about machines changing state is interesting. 

I read PRG's ideas about backtracking and it forced me to ask a similar question.

When backtracking is too long to be replaced by teleporter?

In my map for arcane project player needs to backtrack thru a rather long part of map twice: the first time when he presses the button, the second time when he gets the silver key. So I was thinking about placing teleporter somewhere, but I like to make backtracking much more.

Any ideas? 

Backtracking is a good way to extend the length and monster count of your map, but it's not to be taken lightly.

First, there must be new monsters. Period.

Second, these areas must be designed well enough that the player discovers new gameplay, with new advantages/disadvantages, when he's coming into these areas from the other direction.

Third, don't backtrack too much. The map will wear thin if you make the player haul across the same stuff three or four times.

Fourth, make it clear where he's going. Unless the map has a really unique and varied design that the player can easily remember his way around in, make sure he's ushered in the right direction. The big obvious quake-arrows help. It's a pain wandering around a map where everything looks the same, finding a key, and going, "okay, where the hell was the door?" The player doesn't have a top down view like you do.