News | Forum | People | FAQ | Links | Search | Register | Log in
RemakeQuake
This is a thread about a project currently underway to remake Quake one.

It involves upgrading what exists already in order to play and look better or at least differently in all probable situations and enhance what is already there in this great game.

So we're remixing all the maps, monsters, and the player.

A specific engine in order to solve long-standing issues isn't out of the question, the main concerns being cross-OS support for features that should be common, like entity alpha and multiplayer. These things exist in various forms, but there's still no standard, at least today.

There's a great wealth of resource on this board - the one thing that doesn't exist here is apathy.

So, we're fishing for contributors. If you can make a map, animate or code and want to see this monster through to its conception then you're on the team.

Over the next few days I'll post info on what currently exists, and where it's headed.
First | Previous | Next | Last
Haven't Played This Much Yet... 
my hasty opinions:

- the low health mechanic is cool

- hard to tell friend from foe in the first room of the level

- lack of lighting in places makes it hard to navigate sometimes

- if you can lose your shotgun, it should be possible to regain it. (idea: some grunts drop shotguns) 
Oh I Forgot 
We're all conservative elitist pricks who just 'don't get it', right? I must admit I'm with Text_Fish here. While it's indeed consequent to replace all sounds, it doesn't seem utterly necessary. Whether they are "definitely" an improvement is a matter taste. If they were high-quality versions of the original sounds, nobody would complain, but they are different, in some cases even very much so (naturally, as it's very hard to find proper and free replacements), and often sound weaker (or less frightening if you want) than the originals, e.g. the Vore sounds. Also, I don't know if better quality justifies the file sizes of several MB per sound - even modern games don't use uncompressed audio formats?

Having said that, I think I could live with a complete sound replacement, although my suggestion would be to put them (the sounds that are not immediately needed for the new entities) into a seperate PAK file, so people who wish to play with the originals can simply rename it. Seems like an easy way to please both parties.
My main gripes: Hellknight magic sounds like a laser rifle (the sword swing could use a more powerful/complete whoosh sound); the dog death sound doesn't really sound like a dying dog to me, plus it's too long (maybe cut off the second half); zombie pain sound - female zombies?. Weapon sounds are ok, except for the grenade bounce and the explosion (Quake has a very rich and powerful one, this one sounds rather 'flat'). The nailgun could be a bit 'thinner', higher pitch. No chainsaw idle?
The item pickup sounds are ridiculous - is this Quake or Wold3d?! I would prefer something like 'box pickup->syringe pfff->player ahh', for instance.

I think it's theoretically a good idea to have health vials instead of medkits in non-base maps, though then again it doesn't correspond to the ammo packs (weren't all supplies teleported into the maps by the marines or something?). Also, the models look a bit 'low res', being so clean and all.
The rain drop mdl still looks odd to me. It doesn't seem to have a vertical drop shape, but rather shift to the side. Reskinned (and optimized) nail.mdl might be better - like the single drop (nice effect).

The new weapon balance seems ok at first glance (haven't played many levels). A bit more like Doom, makes one appreaciate the Shotguns more. I don't mind the spread, probably something one gets used to quickly. I don't see why they would explode underwater, though, while the other weapons work. LG decoil, hmm. Would make more sense for the RL really, but I understand your consideration for ballance.

The new Vore missle isn't bad. Might make it easier in rooms with no cover. Of course, you could also have the old behavior appear every now and then, at least on higher skills.
The lava burn is too strong now, in my view - it turns even shallow lava pits into death traps.
Nice teleporter effect.

E3M1RQ: Good work visually. As has been said, the lighting needs tweaking. You've probably tested it on a bright (laptop?) monitor setup, but the dark areas are really dark on other people's. I had to crank up Quake's brightness to 75% in order to be able to find my way (in this sense, it's probably due to the darkness that some people found the progression confusing). And the pitch black areas weren't good, e.g. the slime basement of the map - remember, Quake always renders liquids fullbright, so it looks odd if there're black walls around. Don't use minlight though! A few lower (150-200) sourced lights might enhance the area greatly. And increase the overall light level in most of the rest. It's kind of hard to tell what to do in the reactor room if one can hardly see a thing, for example. In some areas, the rainy sky should give a little more light to the walls, too.
I thought the Ogres didn't really fit there (yes, they're used in many custom base maps, but for some reason they seemed out of place here). Better create a grenade-shooting Enforcer monster, possibly also with a melee attack like some sort of electroshock rod or a handheld buzz saw and bloodsplattered skin.

Finally, I hope you find a way to optimize the maps to work with standard engines 
 
Heh, you can use the lighting gun to climb and fly now. 
Spirit 
Sounds great :D 
 
Will the model of the QuakeGuy's hands be changed? If they are going to show up using the shotgun I think they should look better. 
Could Be 
Which weapon? All? 
Ogres 
Were kind of late to the party - you'll notice there's alot more if you find the DBS.

I wanted Quake minions who weren't necessarily demons, and knights would have been weird.

You'll notice that Enforcers will occassionally lob a grenade (or hunter killer if their flag is set) so a 'more grenades' flag could be the solution.

friend / foe in the first room is kind of a grey issue, since they'll generally get killed anyway and sometimes they'll attack you (bug).

It not quite a scripted sequence, but it's pretty close. I wanted to give the impression of a living place - one in the process of being overrun, or that has just been overrun seconds after the player arrives.

The NPC is flexible enough to have them properly fighting the monsters and we'll be using that in later maps for all sorts of stuff. Maybe an NPC rescuing a helpless player or some such.

Citizen Able Q2 maps will be a great inspiration there.

Also HL2's various mission types - the NPC unlocks the door.

And final thing about the sounds - alot of them are higher quality of the originals, courtesy of Mindgrid. 
Don't Get Me Wrong... 
I think this is a good mod -- more on par with Nehahra than with Quoth (minus the feature-length movie, of course) -- it's just the name that bothers me. I guess what I was half expecting was something more like a Quake HD with higher poly models and 32-bit textures with uber-detailed levels. This, on the other hand, is something different. Gameplay-wise, there are some neat things going on. Sound-wise, there are some no-so-neat things going on. The rest-wise, well, we will wait and see...but I do look forward to it.

Keep up the good work! 
Thanks 
There's plenty of projects that pretty the game up though. Textures packs and a few modeling ones.

Being compared to Nehahra is a great compliment. 
Ankh 
Seems like you had fun with the mod, reliving the levels.

Haven't watched them all yet, but they're pretty morale boosting. 
Give Me A Shout If You Fancy 
Remaking a map :) 
Some Thoughts 
We've been playing this game for 13 years, so we know every subtlety of gameplay and design. Every little thing you change will be noticed and mercilessly scrutinized. And there are certain expectations that we have about how Quake looks and feels. Obviously any changes to that will be challenged. The RMQ team has been hyping their mod for a while here on func, in subtle and not-so-subtle ways. Someone on the team says, "oh this map played really cool in RMQ," or about some mapping feature, "yeah we'll have that in RMQ." So, subtle expectations have been created, and now we finally see it, and it is both less and more than we imagined...

So about those sounds. Yeah, they're 44.1khz. Great. I don't care, if they are bad and out of place, which a lot of them are. Let's look at the grunt sounds. You see, I have a certain expectation of what a grunt is. I imagine them to be half-human genetic experiments or something, a creature far more capable of killing than speech. The originals did not utter a single intelligible word. Did you forget? He is called a GRUNT, not "some guy yelling random shit at me." It is seriously jarring to hear them actually talking and I don't like it. Make a new monster, like an evil marine or something, if you want chatter and taunts, please.

Here's another specific criticism: I don't like it when identical-looking enemies fire different weapons. It breaks my expectations. I do see that the grunts have different guns modeled, but that's not enough to tell them apart in a dark room or the heat of battle. Obviously there's a specific way to engage a shotgun grunt vs a grenade grunt, and if you do it wrong you die. In Quoth, you can learn the differences between the green guys, red guys, orange guys, blue guys, etc, and plan accordingly. For what it's worth, this lack of grunt differentiation annoyed me in Nehahra as well.

Well that's a lotta rambling. I'll say more about specific things when it's not 3:30 am... 
 
The nailgrunts are supposed to be carrying visually different guns. I'm not a fan of 'new skin = rockets' type monsters, so the idea is for each to be different in outline for just the reasons you mention.

The HyperEnforcer for example will have a much bulkier weapon, connected to his backpack by a cable - just a case of getting the modeling and animation done.

Less grunt chatter, noted. 
 
My opinion is that Quake moves too fast for outlines to mean much. Large differences like a knight compared to an ogre work, but different guns - no. Colors may seem cartoony but they are the quickest thing to pick up on in the middle of a fire fight. 
Depends On The Lighting. 
And the nailgrunts already have a slightly different armour colour.

The idea is for them to carry nailguns as opposed to a stick. Maybe it'll be worth changing the shotgun to a proper shotgun as well. It's a handful of polys more but visually completely different.

Really, the Enforcer and grunt weapons are like giant cigars with a few lights and stuff.

For the Enforcer he'll have a modified powerpack in place of a backpack and a big cable connecting it to his gun - so it should be visually very different.

Skins will be a matter of course. 
Perhaps 
you could make very subtle scale differences between the different types of grunt/enforcer. I.E. taller/fatter/whatever. On paper it may not be a huge difference but I'd say it's the sort of thing people would pick up on and react to subconsciously.

I too find the colour coordinated variations in other mods somewhat cheesy but ultimately, bad game play is a problem ten times bigger.

Not to flog a dead horse, but I hope the fact that pretty much everybody has uniformly complained about the sounds is enough to warrant a major change in direction there. 
QuakeGuy Hands 
Yes, all the weapons, I think Q2 quality hands would be enough. 
Hm 
There's no way that we'll be binning months of work, but its a big contrast how those here and those on other forums have reacted.

The only mention of bad sounds elsewhere has been the rain being too loud. But yeah, consideration. 
 
episode 3 demos recorded in joequake - if anyone is interested. It is still fun to play this.
http://www.quaketastic.com/upload/files/demos/rmq_ep3.zip

e2m3 - is someone working on it? Not that I promise anything :) 
I Was A Bit Uncomfortable In A Good Way ... 
I didn't know what to expect when I was playing the demo but I liked what I felt.

I completely didn't understand the rules, the enemies and had no sense of level progression because the monster counter wouldn't show me the number of monsters.

I felt like I was playing a version of Quake 2 that didn't suck -- and I mean that in the most complimentary kind of way possible.

It was like playing a drastically different Quake mod where I had no idea what the rules were, no idea what the goals were and no sense of comfort.

The surroundings were familiarish but I never developed any kind of comfort.

Newblars think "gee wiz I want high res graphics" simply because they don't know any better, but veterans want high-res gameplay.

If mystery and lack of comfort are the key to suspense, I can easily claim to have never felt safe as I played this. Way too many unexpected things happened for me to have that kind of comfort.

Quake 2's stupid goals and objectives really impeded my joy of the game and I don't claim to have progressed far in Quake 2 -- I did try it again recently due to gb's long-time and aguirRe's seemingly recent Q2 passion.

Remake Quake felt like some unfamiliar game set in a somewhat familiar environment -- so very unfamiliar despite the familiar surroundings and enemies.

I guess I never expected a Quake mod to be so unexpected. I haven't played a Quake mod that successfully removed my sense of security.

In recent history, the only other map that really freaked me out was the ijed Spacehulk 256 map where fiends kept being behind me from nowhere and I continually died.

Yes, this isn't your traditional Quake experience, but maybe it shouldn't be. With a few hundred awesome single player maps in stock, maybe the "traditional" Quake experience has played itself out as much as it needs to be. 
Well Said, Baker 
Expectations create a comfort zone - if the goal is to make the player uncomfortable, then that's not necessarily a bad thing.

About the rain - I certainly like the idea, it makes the map much more atmospheric. It would be nice if the sound got louder when you approach a window or went outside - maybe it did, but the difference was quite subtle and it was still pretty loud inside. Of course, I realize there are limits to what quake's attenuation will allow. 
Ijed 
You know how it is. Non-developer communities tend to appreciate anything without critical consideration. At least people here care enough to comment in one way or another (even if it sometimes sounds harsher than possibly intended).

Base ogre: I think LTH made a base skin for ogres (Trinca used it in one of his base maps). It would still feel a little odd, but also make things a lot easier. Just insert the second skin and add "skin" "1" to the ogres in the base maps. 
I Rly Like That Idea, Negke! 
I was never a fan of ogres in base maps pureply ecause they looked out of place, so giving them a base skin would probablt make me use them more... 
 
chif my best map ever and u dont remeber the name negke? :(

trincasp3 tree map pack 
 
chif my best map ever and u dont remeber the name negke? :(

trincasp3 tree map pack 
First | Previous | Next | Last
You must be logged in to post in this thread.
Website copyright © 2002-2024 John Fitzgibbons. All posts are copyright their respective authors.