but also standard limitations on clipnodes etc. 

I previously have had no problems in my test maps with Q1 monsters in Q3 bsp's. Of course the hull construction has to be different to accomadate the crouching mode.

I had planned to send you one of my test maps, but when I tested it in Dark Places the bugger crashed! I have been tweeking the Dark Places code for my own sordid purposes, so that may be the culprit and then again, it could be a corrupted .bsp

I suggest building a small DM map with a good deal of connectivity and then running Reaperbots in the map. If the reapers can navigate in it then surely any monster set up you may have in mind would definitely work.

I'll get back to you later in the day. 

Sounds cool. I'd like to hear from any Q3 gurus, how do the hulls work in Q3 bsp? Logic would suggest that there only needs to be two hulls - a player hull and a crouch hull. Either way, they must be different to the Q1 hulls. So how does DarkPlaces handle the monster clipping? 

if you could put in the r_drawflat on your glquake engine, that'd be nice. ;) 

OK, I'll see what I can do. I have already a version where most of the improvements from my GLQuake seem to work, but there are a few weird things I'll have to investigate further. WinQuake also have the r_draworder cvar that's useful for checking visibility.

Kinn: Yes, clipbrushes are always removed entirely from hull 0. I actually haven't thought of if this is correct or not when using the hull # option.

Necros: I don't know how much work that is atm, maybe later. 

The bsp was corrupt. For shame! I am compiling a new version of it at this time. Currently it is giving Q3map2 a run for its money. I made extreme rez textures (each is at least 4 megs in size) for it with the idea of compiling the light maps and then replacing the textures with lower rez ones later.

As it stands it would actually be a decent map for Quake 3 Tourney, well after the textures are replaced, and a sky box is added . . . 

AguirRe, would it be difficult to make clipbrushes visible in -hull# builds? That would strike me as quite a useful option, as it would give a true visual indication of the clipping hull.

HeadThump, 4 meg textures? o_O. I hadn't thought of the idea of using hi-res textures to generate lightmaps, then replacing the textures. Although I don't think i'll be going down that road. 

It sounds like a good idea and it also appears easy to implement. But after looking at a typical DM map where large parts of the walls, floors etc are covered with the clip texture, I'm not so sure it's such a good idea.

Maybe this sounds awkward, but you can get a similar effect by just replacing "clip" with e.g. "clap" in a temporary copy of the map file and build with the hull # option.

You'll then either see the "clap" texture (if there is one) or the checkerboard pattern instead of the clipbrushes.

Have you tried this?

The search/replace operation can be automated using a standard sed (stream edit) utility if it needs to be repeated. 

They played like manly men. No problems.

A few notes about the Dark Places Q3 bsp implementation that is even different from its Q1 protocol. Ambient lights are stripped out and only sourced lights are used.

Models for the sourced lights are stripped out too. Its the biggest bitch I have with DP. You have to custom cache them in your mod like you did with that huge flame in Bastion (I know this works in Bastion, I've done a little, uhm, experimenting with it on the side).

You can convert the flames to Spr32 format and you'll get some sweet high high rez particle effects with them. Also, you can use glow or luma textures on surface lights. You wont even miss the old ambient light entity everywhere.

I'll convert everything to low rez so I can ship it to you. Don't expect much from those textures. They are just place holder solids. 

how do i make 2 buttons to open one door? been trying to figure it out by myself for a while, but no luck. :(

this is for q1, me uses worldcraft 

AguirRe, that sounds reasonable, I hadn't thought of doing a temporary texture replacement.

HeadThump, email received, but Outlook Express detects it as a virus for some f'kin stupid reason, so I can't view it. 

give your "func_door" a targetname of "xxx" and then create a "trigger_counter" with a targetname of "yyy". Set the count of the "trigger_counter" to 2 and give it a target of "xxx" (same as the targetname of the "func_door"). Then give both buttons a target of "yyy" (same as the targetname of the "trigger_counter") and your done. 

Of all the programs to complain about viruses. I checked that zip package with Avast antivirus before sending it out. I'm pretty carefull about that sort of thing.

But I'll just upload it to the geocities site when I get back in this afternoon. 

Cheers, that would be cool. 

Instead of clipping hulls like quake and half-life use, quake 2 and quake 3 store the original brushes from the map file and use those for collision. This is why monsters in quake 2 can be all different sizes.

How this works is, clipping hulls are basically bsps built out of pre-expanded brushes. Since they are pre-expanded, they are built for specific entity sizes. But in quake2 and 3, the brushes are expanded on the fly, which means they can be expanded differently for each entity size they encounter. 

thanks man. will go try that now. :) 

That sounds very interesting. Q3 bsp is definately an option I will look into, although not for my current map; perhaps the one after that. 

ok. it worked. but i cant get the door to stay closed! i gave it a 0 delay but it keeps closing. it works with a regular door but with this one it doesnt seem to work. :( 

It's the [q]wait[/i] field that determines the wait before closing. Set it to [q]-1[/q] if you don't want it to close. 

beautiful!! thanks guys, you been really helpful. :) 

what kind of a map are you working on? Any info or screenshots anywhere? 

actually, i havent started anything yet. just trying out stuff and seeing what i can do before i get my hands into something serious. 

'That sounds very interesting. Q3 bsp is definately an option I will look into, although not for my current map; perhaps the one after that.'

I share your sentiments. My current out put targets FitzQuake given high rez (non-palated) textures and good light sampling looks fantastic in it. Also, most lower end machines can handle it without a performance hit (though I'm less certain about those first generation Voodoo cards).

By the time I'm finished with it, I'll be targeting Doom 3 anyway. So the grand Dark Places mod I have had in mind for some time will likely never come to light. 

Yes, Doom3 looks like a really attractive option for me too. So far I've missed the boat with all the other id games, so with D3 I might get a chance to start mapping at the beginning with everyone else. Although I'd be making Evil Gothic Death Castles (tm) - I'm not sure I really dig the idea of making endless crate-tastic base levels.

I downloaded your dptest level, but when I load it in DarkPlaces, the whole level is pitch black (r_fullbright 1 does nothing) Also, I can see all the ammo/health boxes in the level at once, dotted around in space like some wierd ammo box constellation. What version of DP are you using? 

and the lighting doesn't show up. It must have something to do with my texture/lightmap experiments. Rename the texture file Venice so DP doesn't read it in and the lighting will show up.

I use the beta available on Inside3d.com but modified with my own code (mostly to do with entity behavoir and interpolation so it should not effect the light display, in theory).