and all the shots are full of clich�s but might still be fun if they keep the gameplay as mindless action DooM style 

With Painkiller's (lack of) level design, the game was basically stillborn. It's a shame, because it could have been a great game. 

as bad as painkiller's gameplay might have been, it had fantastic looking maps. since they're using the q3 engine, i wouldn't expect it to look as good as PK, but i think it's something to be strived for, regardless. 

since they're using the q3 engine, i wouldn't expect it to look as good as PK

"nearly as good" is fair enough for me, atleast one can expect good fps from the well optimized q3 engine; whereas for me PK runs with 250 fps in an empty map, but as soon as monsters appear it goes down into the 30 fps range, no matter the settings. Not acceptable. 

I haven't tried it, but I'd assume that a good artist could throw enough pollies and textures at the Q3 engine and probably make it look just as good as PK, whilst running a lot faster. 

The Q3 engine has always been my choice for 'remake of classic quake' fantasy.

a good artist could throw enough pollies and textures

This for me is the problem. One must do more than throw polys and pixels to be a good artist.

The screenshots on Blue's are less than stellar. They have that all-too-common style of game design that looks like someone burned a new age jewellery shop to the ground, dumped the debris in a skip, then threw me in after it.
Glowing, sparking, purple crystals? Really?

Your shaders have to be really neat to make such gaudy choices work. And here's a tip for aspiring modellers out there: if your skillset doesn't cover human anatomy, don't show hands on the weapon models, especially skeletal hands.

Look, I want a decent Quake-like game too. The FPS industry has been choking on so much concrete for the last several years I think my body has actually developed a chemical tolerance to it.
And these guys are at least putting in the work, slogging away for seven years. I wish them luck.
But even Painkiller, with a decent budget thrust up it's heavy-metal backside like a stake in a bloated corpse, wasn't more than a simplistic shadow of what is truly enjoyable about Doom and Quake.

I'll probably buy it when it arrives, more as an expression of solidarity than a vote of confidence.


- Kell McDonald, still waiting for a proper high-poly shambler :( 

Ask Lunaran. I think he's got a high-poly shambler somewhere. 

Yeah, forgot about that. He surreptitiously linked me it when I was sleeping. The perv.

That's a modification of the Q1 shamb though. Not a remake for a Q3-or-later engine.

A new shambler must have fully modelled jaws bearing vicious thorny growths that serve as teeth for the vile beast. And rugose, mouldy flesh that hangs in scabrous furrows from its hulking semi-simian frame, swaying repulsively as it lumbers towards the luckless victim...terrible, barbed claws...that reach...



Excuse me, I have to lie down. 

Sup Kell :}

This for me is the problem. One must do more than throw polys and pixels to be a good artist.

I wasn't claiming that makes a good artist because it doesn't (obviously it doesn't).

My point is that a typical environment in PK uses a triangle count and an amount of texture data somewhat in excess of that seen in Quake 3. To make a visually comparable scene in the Q3 engine, you are probably going to be adopting triangle and texture budgets similar in magnitude. An experienced environment artist of course will use the usual tricks and optimisations to make the most of what he has at his diposal. 

Hello guys :).

Good discussion. PK had some good-looking and striking maps, they just didn't play as exciting as their themes.

I tend to agree with Kell. I think that's the second time that's happened this month! 

I thought Randy's Shambler was a good start:
http://qexpo2005.quakedev.com/booths/randy/148.html

It seems like the Shambler is the most memorable monster as there are loads of fanart. Maybe I will compile a post with some good ones.
This one is most excellent in my opinion:
http://fc02.deviantart.com/fs28/f/2008/050/0/f/Shambler_by_David_the_Cenobite.jpg
http://david-the-cenobite.deviantart.com/art/Shambler-77903614 

of design - "look, we can do this!" instead of thinking "should we do this?".

It's an easy trap to fall into, especially since once new feature X is included the team fires headlong into yet another new feature, instead of getting the previous one to work properly.

Then delviery day comes and the good bits are diluted in a soup of unfinished features. 

That Shambler model is excellent. 

My comments about a Q3-engine PK clone potentially looking good were not in any way refering to that game on Bluesnews, the screenshots of which I didn't bother checking out until now.

Also don't you just hate it when a couple of modders call themselves some stupid shit like "Mangled Eye Studios", completely giving away the fact that it's just some angsty kid and maybe one or two of his internet friends mucking about in the Q3 engine (for seven years apparently). 

Vanilla Q3 is not particularly fast. Try standing in the worst spots of blacktown or tvy-bench - my 7950GT gets single digit framerates for scenes that a modern engine should fly through at 100 FPS or more.

There's a bunch of reasons for this, which boil down the the fact that q3 is a decade old and wasn't written for the fast paths of modern hardware. 

I agree with BlackDog I guess 

those are unoptimized 3rd party maps and ofcourse it�s easy to kill an engine fps-wise by not minding it�s limits (there are plenty of those on lvl); pom.pk3 also runs poorly for me with maxed gfx, but quake engines were always weak rendering big open spaces.

Show me one 8 years old engine that is still able to look very good in these days and also gives good fps. ---> Q3 <3 

i think it's more the number of polygons/surfaces the engine's not good at. 

Finished Dark Messiah. Was good. Fairly long and substantial. Would have happily played more of it, got into the style of the game. The semi-RPG elements were pretty effective, I tended partway between jack of all trades and a swordsman, I definitely could have original chosen to go in different directions. Some great settings and fantasy styles too, and good gameplay. A bit clunky in feel sometimes, and some random slow downs, but otherwise a fantasy thumbs up. 

Hmm, they totally cripple any physics worth mentioning so all that is left is aim.
But even then, the constant spawning while player reloads/turns his back is sure to unnerve even the most patient players.

I guess they just design these games w�th the concept in mind that players save every 30 seconds so it seems to be no problem. Pffft. 

Sweet jesus lord on multiple vibrating sticks!

This is the most fun I have had online in a LONG time! You can level up your character and unlock all sorts of things for each of the weapons such as grips (reduce recoil), and various laser sights, scopes and silencers. You can also select 3 "perks" for each loadout you create, these are little tweaks you can make to your character to make it a little better, these are as simple as faster reloads and faster weapon firing, through to dropping a live grenade when you die (hehe) and extra bullet penetration through walls.

Ahh yes, bullet penetration, this game does it perfectly! Firing through thin objects with a beefy gun will actually hit people behind thin walls and obstacles, you can tell your hitting someone because you get that funny "dink" sound, this is so much fun!

Blah that was fairly incoherent, but I can't be arsed to re-type it when I can be back in the game. I am level 32 now (55 is the max) and have more unlocks to chase! 

Yeah, as much as I hate to admit it (so bored of realistic war games), Call of Duty 4 is a really good game, the solo is really well made and fun, and the multiplayer is great action, nothing like CounterStrike etc... So much that I'm lvl 55 twice (at home and at work). =)

In the end though, after playing it for 2 months, we've gone back to TF2 at work, and that remains the best multiplayer FPS of the moment for me. =) 

He loves teh latex! 

I tried COD4 MP and it was ass :(

Mind you, I'm sure the actual GAME is good, but it felt like shit to play. There was an INSANE amount of view bob with ridiculously exaggerated animation of the player arms and stuff. The weapons fire just didn't feel right either... and everything looked the same (same colours everywhere on the environment and players), I couldn't see shit.

I guess I'm just too picky and have played Quake based stuff too much - nothing else ever feels as solid or as nice as that.

I haven't actually tried the single player yet, but I will eventually (it's on my list). I'm sure I'll like it, I loved the original COD single player (and, incidentally, thought the multiplayer was ass... :) 

I bought it based on the demo. Maybe next on the agenda to play. Yeah it feels like ass but it has bags of style.