#15374 posted by adib on 2015/09/04 07:25:14
The impact on end user is a level portalized in a more rational way. Visibility will be based on walls enclosing the room, not the six uber detailed pilars or the chandelier inside it, ones you will carefully turn into func_detail. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
#15375 posted by JneeraZ on 2015/09/04 12:04:26
adib - No, that's right. You should func_detail anything that will create a ton of cuts and portals for no real benefit.
#15376 posted by Rick on 2015/09/04 12:30:16
As far as I know, the only reason to use func_detail is to speed up vis. If done correctly, the player will have no idea that they were used. Do it wrong and the player will see brushes start disappearing. Func_detail brushes have no effect on how qbsp chops up the brushes.
@Rick
#15377 posted by oGkspAz on 2015/09/04 14:42:38
That sounds like the issue I was having with my text shaped brushes on the one wall.
Func_detail
#15378 posted by Kinn on 2015/09/09 23:10:53
As far as I know, the only reason to use func_detail is to speed up vis
Actually, is there a run-time benefit too? e.g. let's say you have a huge and detailed map - it's better for performance to have fewer visleaves (with more polys in them) than tons and tons of small visleaves, right? I'm guessing func_detail results in less visleaves?
#15379 posted by ericw on 2015/09/10 00:38:05
tyrutils qbsp (and I assume rebb's as well) uses knowledge of which faces are func_detail in its bsp heuristic; it will try to use non-detail faces to divide up volume in preference to detail faces.
That might give a more optimal bsp tree, but aside from that, using func_detail creates just as many visleafs as not using it, so I wouldn't expect any difference at runtime.
Texture Questions
1) What is the correct file format for textures? E.g. let's say I want to modify an existing texture. I know how to use TexMex to export it from a texture wad, and how to add it back in, but I'm not sure what file format I should choose when doing so (I am guessing the answer is not jpg).
2) Would Gimp be a suitable programme for modifying/creating textures?
3) I think I understand the theory behind using skip textures, but why is it possible to see skip textures (as in, see a brush face with "skip" written all over it) in some maps? Shouldn't those brush faces be invisible? An example would be Day of the Lords: if you noclip through it, there are moments where you can see "skip" written on brush faces.
Correct file format is .pcx file
I'm sure gimp would work ok. I use paintshop pro 7.
You shouldn't be able to see skip textures, must be one of those weird quirks of the game if you can see them by noclipping through stuff.
#15382 posted by mfx on 2015/09/10 23:56:48
http://www.celephais.net/stuff/texturefaq.htm
The skip faces you see are accidental leftovers i'd say, todays compilers "skip" them ahead of the final bsp compile, were the old tools just draw them and had to be removed with a special compile switch and/or tool.
Gimp is fine, dont expect it to work wonders tho..
Thanks For The Quick Answers, Fifth And Mfx
Thanks for that link; I was actually reading through that before posting to see if it would answer any of my questions (I had a look here http://quakewiki.org/wiki/Textures too).
So if I shouldn't expect too much from Gimp, what is the better alternative? (Just curious; I wouldn't be able to afford any non-free software anyway)
#15384 posted by Rick on 2015/09/11 01:01:18
I've always found Gimp and Photoshop too much of a pain to use for Quake textures. Their world is 24 bit.
I have an old copy of PSP 4.0 (still runs on Windows 7) that I use for making and modifying Quake textures. It works with 256 color palette graphics pretty well. I've always used the .bmp format.
I tried a newer version of PSP (x5), but it was way overly complicated for most of what I do, so I deleted it.
Rick
#15385 posted by adib on 2015/09/11 04:14:06
What kind of pain you have using Photoshop to make Quake textures? You can switch between RGB and "indexed" color modes, I have the Quake palette with and without fullbright lines... Want help?
+1 For Photoshop
#15386 posted by killpixel on 2015/09/11 04:19:42
It's worth putting time into to learn imo. There are good reasons it's an industry standard (and not so goon ones).
Of course, it can be pretty cost prohibitive, which is one of the reasons I should eat my words and learn GIMP.
#15387 posted by Lunaran on 2015/09/11 05:48:14
Photoshop is great for Quake textures. Make heavy use of the 'gradient map' layer, and make yourself a set of gradients that match the rows of the Quake palette to use with them.
For Index Colors
I use LVPro
#15389 posted by Rick on 2015/09/11 10:45:48
It's just a personal preference thing, but I find these modern graphics/photo editing programs to have have an overly complex and cluttered up interface for something as simple as editing a bitmap.
I do have a copy of Gimp in my portable folder, some day I may give it another look.
Wally?
#15390 posted by Spirit on 2015/09/11 12:57:49
#15391 posted by JneeraZ on 2015/09/11 13:05:43
I've never thought of the Photoshop interface as cluttered. If you use hotkeys to flip between tools and create new layers when you need them, the interface is basically negligible.
Jpg Is The Worst Fucking Format For Anything Ever
#15392 posted by ijed on 2015/09/11 14:34:37
Each time you save something in it, the quality downgrades.
+1 For Wally
#15393 posted by Orl on 2015/09/11 14:48:24
As Spirit said. It's nowhere near as feature rich as Photoshop or Gimp, but its tools are basic enough for anyone to create and or edit some really good textures. That and it was made for the sole purpose of creating Quake textures, so that should be a plus.
#15394 posted by adib on 2015/09/11 15:09:58
I use Wally just to handle wads.
It's To Bad...
#15395 posted by damage_inc on 2015/09/11 15:24:42
That editors and engines haven't moved on from the ".wad" file format! For mappers that is. A few older external programs could be eliminated along with it.
#15396 posted by Kinn on 2015/09/11 15:52:05
That editors and engines haven't moved on from the ".wad" file format! For mappers that is. A few older external programs could be eliminated along with it.
Reading individual 8-bit images from a folder, instead of .wad files, could be neat (if you happen to use the one compiler and one editor that might actually implement it).
#15397 posted by adib on 2015/09/11 16:03:53
Most new GL engines support "external" textures, 24 bit plain files on the filesystem. Quakespasm, Fitzquake, Darkplaces do. They override textures inside BSP files and have to be placed at <mod folder>/textures. They can even be used on a single level if you place them at <mod folder>/textures/<map name>
#15398 posted by adib on 2015/09/11 16:05:49
... meaning you don't have to bother about Quake palette anymore if you don't care about backward compatibility.
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