no way to fix it? the level loses a lot of atmosphere without fog. 

fog 0.05 1 1 1
and if that still is not enough increase the first number (0.05). 

You need to find the silver key door which is around the corner from the start area. The texture isn't very obvious that its even a door but look carefully and you will find it.

Jaromir83 - check out JPL's Slime Refinery Complex, Invein for Nehahra (not D3, but similar theme). 

I guess I am too much of a free free give give open Linux lunatic. And of course I am no artist myself in this matter.

one more reason to be anal about licenses (as long as we have this shitty copyright thing in use) 

that was directed at spirit, and of course i only wanted to quote the first part of it :( 

anywhere near the start or it comes later? because I cant see it. 

No fog nor coloured lighting in AGLQuake... 

here, well fitzhack. I see coloured lighting. 

the fog is there in aglquake, just really really thin. i had to go back & check it was there based on people's comments & the only place i could notice it was in the main shaft with the spaceship-on-a-lift thing; the rest of the level is too confined for it to have much of an effect unless you change the values (like spirit mentioned above) 

...well, dead Enforcers anyway. 

Fog is rendered very engine-specific in different engine. aguirRe's glquake, Fitzquake, Darkplaces, all very different.
Same settings in those three:
http://www.quaddicted.com/quake_engines/engine_screenshots/engine_fog_aguirresglquake.jpg
http://www.quaddicted.com/quake_engines/engine_screenshots/engine_fog_darkplaces.jpg
http://www.quaddicted.com/quake_engines/engine_screenshots/engine_fog_fitzquake.jpg 

... it would be cool to "harmonize" fog rendering :P 

yet remember, maps like "Hell In A Can" are utterly fantastic, and they deviate so much from the traditional q1sp fare! 

Haven't finished this yet, because of frustration. Almost every encounter is a forewarned situation - if you're not, then you die. If you don't die then you die on the next encounter.

Think you've moved out of the 'reasonable expectation' parameters a bit, but I'll come back to the map and finish it before complaining any more. 

On skill 1.

Found the first half pretty easy, because I knew where the monsters were.

3 eliminators = 2 enforcers, 2 defenders, 2 rocketeers?

Shambler ambush and bridge ambush were ok, but why throw in two Vorelings after the Shambler?

Theres stuff here that by convention would be secret - trinity, 1st nailgun.

Was it a late decision not to give the SSG from the start? I ask because the enemy mix is the same (at the start) skills 1-3 and the player has nothing to fight back the overpowered Quoth enemies with apart from the SG. If they get the not a secret NG then its more survivable, but only if they get the GA as well.

There was alot of stuff that just didn't work, IMHO, although the geometry and lighting were ok. Still can't say I like the texture set much either. 

As long as the texture has been converted "down to" Quake, they are not the same anymore, so the copyright does not apply IMHO.
Also, as long as the texture set origin (i.e Doom3, etc..) is mentionned, then the mapper gave credit by default to the company who created the game... so need for a long copyright "story" to give credits :P
And the last, as long as we are not making money with our map, as long as we are just mapping for fun, where is the problem ? Are we stoling money ?

The only thing I could understand to be blamed for, is that I distored the original Doom3 texture set, and that's it... The only thing distrans could be blamed for is trying to innovate, and show something else than "standard" gameplay and ID textures...

Anyway, at least distrans seemed to be happy with his map, and regarding the map quality (I'm talking about architecture, etc.... but it is my own taste....) I cannot say much more than bravo ! I want to see more Doom3 textured map ;) 

As long as the texture has been converted "down to" Quake, they are not the same anymore, so the copyright does not apply IMHO.

That's so untrue I'm not even going to bother counter-arguing.

Meh, I'm a hypocrite of sorts - I ripped assets from quake 3, hexen 2 etc. in my maps - at that point, tons of people had. Doom 3 though? I dunno, I think it's certainly dodgier ripping from Doom 3 than ripping from, say, an id or raven game from the '90s. 

"As long as the texture has been converted "down to" Quake, they are not the same anymore, so the copyright does not apply IMHO. "

So you're saying as long as I change the palette on artwork, it's free to use? 

in my maps. I'm no texture artist, and also I create my maps entirely for my own personal enjoyment. All us Quake mappers are enthusiasts, and therefore it is a pure and worthy love of these textures which compels us to use them. Surely the original artists and creators of the textures would be honoured to have us use their work for our sculptures!

I think what JPL is trying to express is that the textures arent even used in their original 24 bit states, and that the modern standard of quality isn't even met by the resulting textures, so there is no threat of the textures causing any competition to the products of their original uses. 

So you're saying as long as I change the palette on artwork, it's free to use?

Doom3 texture are 24 bits, and Quake texture are 8 bit indexed palette... and when you know that a Doom3 textures are made of normal, diffuse, shadow, etc... tga files, converting a texture down to Quake is resulting in a complete different "look".. The most difficult was to obtain almost the same rendering as Doom3 looks... I failed I know...

Otherwise why do you think I spent 2 months on that if it was just a "palette change" ?

Come on be serious, it is not like importing Hexxen wad file to Quake wad file: Doom3 converted set has nothing to doo with original Doom3 texture set... except it looks the same :P 

Most certainly you are. If I counted correctly Bastion was released just 41 months after Q3A, while this map was released 45 months after Doom 3. And then Quake 3 proved to have a much longer lifespan than D3. You are evil!
at that point, tons of people had should not change any "wrongness of the action" in your eyes. Also these Doom 3 textures have been used in other maps before too. 

I understand that it's illegal.

I don't understand that, in the contexts we are talking about, it's immoral.

Id artists put the time and effort into making (Doom3) textures as their job. We pay money for Doom3 and thus pay their deserved earnings.

Then a mapper takes some textures from Doom3 and uses them in a non-commercial release for a niche market. A small amount of people (most of whom will have also bought Doom3) play and, errr, enjoy that map.

The textures don't go any further. The maps aren't sold. The converted textures aren't sold. Nobody makes any more money from using someone else's work, and nobody at Id loses any money from having those textures used.

Further, credit is given to Id, so all the players know that the mapper didn't create the textures, but some Id artist did, so artistic kudos goes to that artist.

Problem?? 

I think you nicely summarize my thoughts ;) 

So you're saying as long as I change the palette on artwork, it's free to use?

Doom3 texture are 24 bits, and Quake texture are 8 bit indexed palette... and when you know that a Doom3 textures are made of normal, diffuse, shadow, etc... tga files, converting a texture down to Quake is resulting in a complete different "look".. The most difficult was to obtain almost the same rendering as Doom3 looks... I failed I know...


Instant fail for even trying to argue that point. 

...after I stole the car, I replaced the number plates, filed down the number on the license block, and resprayed it a different colour. So really, it's not the same car...