although I do think the discussion in this thread has been unfair to you (even if I was quite amused by it), why would you be so surprised that a guy who started mapping for Quake 2-3 years ago wouldn't know who headshot is? Lunaran's response was much more helpful; how are people new to the community ever going to find out anything if it's just like OMG YOU DONT KNOW?!
anyway, not condemning you, I'm sure this thread has been enough of a nuisance to you

PS: untried texture combinations that would be cool:

Egyptian (of any type) + Kell
Daikatana E3 + Kell (fmb_bdg was doing this a little)
IKwhite + Heretic 2 

Er.... I give up

How am I supposed to know stuff like that?

Who is allowed to start a thread because they have returned to mapping more - Kona or Headshot?

Well I have never heard of Headshot, but Kona I have. Go figure. Im not a l00tist n33b, or whatever it is you might say.... 

I've actually tried Kell with a bunch of things, including egypt textures as well as idbase. The egypt project was going pretty well too I must say, I should look into finishing it/finding it on my HDD somewhere. 

sounds like an orgy
if I ever started a new from scratch map, I was going to do a whole new map depicting a decrepit Middle Eastern city with ancient Egyptian tombs/ruins throughout - vaguely similar to the style of the "Arabian Nights," but much larger and more detailed, using Rogue/Hexen2/Sock Egypt textures, but with a huge amount of Kell textures, using Quoth2 - and call it "Nyarlathotep"

but I will never have time.

idbase+kell sounds bizarrely cool 

kell made like 10 texture sets, which one are you talking about? 

jebus so kell's done quoth1+2, contract revoked, and like 10 textures sets! i'd say he is quake's saviour of the 2000's. 

knave.wad, kdmtex.wad, apocryphal.wad

basically the classic stone/metal/bookcases look 

Whao, long time buddy. 

BIFF! 

How am I supposed to know stuff like that?

Because we helpfully tell you these things, after the requisite expression of disbelief.

Who is allowed to start a thread because they have returned to mapping more - Kona or Headshot?

Anyone can start a thread. 

The ritual stoning always take place, or only for posts as stupid as this one? 

with me

band finished 

X is leet enough to start a thread, Y is not - is retarded
I respect headshot as much as anyone, but as soon as it becomes subjective you lose your ability to condemn the guy for starting a thread

anyway, fuck the idea of the community being elitist at all. No one gets ANY KIND of status, or respect, or self esteem boost, that is unwarranted based on their current reasonability and activity in the community. You build up pyramids and stacks of self-reinforcing respect and worship and try to pass this shit along, you are nothing more than a self-contained group of self-esteem masturbators, no better than any man who knows how to masturbate. I will continually praise the maps of people who I think are great but I never give their name a royal goddamn deference.

you have an opinion you have to explain it to justify it. Otherwise, you've got no more say than some dumbass who showed up yesterday and thinks e1m1 is the best Q1 map ever made. 

why would you be so surprised that a guy who started mapping for Quake 2-3 years ago wouldn't know who headshot is?

Tronyn

I'm sorry for quoting you but Deja-Vu came out 1 year Ago. And it took me six weeks to make. I have been mapping for one year. 27th Septmeber. Thats when it came out. 

well after so much time in Q1 I really have no idea what happened when; I don't mind, in fact what you are saying helps my argument; the fact is, if people like you did not show up every year or so and start contributing (if it has been only a year since you showed up! crazy to think!) then there would be no community. 

well, i thought e1m1 was pretty cool :P 

and now he knows, wtf is the big deal here

No one gets ANY KIND of status, or respect, or self esteem boost, that is unwarranted based on their current reasonability and activity in the community.

This is funny because I'm not sure you're aware that you're still kind of describing elitism. 

without being a cock

(this isnt aimed at anyone, but its interesting, do you think it's possible?) 

For as long as this crap has been going, there's always been some spanktard whining about elitism because of some perceived injustice or whatever.

The simple fact is that we always have been and always will be accepting of and helpful to new mappers. Good maps get the recognition they deserve. What else do you want? (We even put up with Ricky... ;)

A lot of people here have some pretty high standards, but both crusty old-timers and newcomers alike are held to the same high standards. Generally this is a good thing and results in higher quality maps being released. Occasionally someone decides to get hyper-sensitive and takes personal offense to criticism, but hey, welcome to the internet kids... grow a thick skin or fuck off. 

i've had a lot of support from the community, you can just look at it as a list of what could be good and what sucks, i.e. what to do and what not to do

also just learning how to make a map work, learning the importance of engine limits etc, vis blocking, ra ra ra

:) 

alright sorry, you are right that in the last few years the community has generally been welcoming/supportive. I apologize. 

there been plenty of offensive stuff said to me and others, but you can either take offense to it or just take the point and move on. 

the issue, that I'm guilty as much as (or more than) anyone else, is shit when it's uncalled for. In the many Quaddicted interviews so far released (thanks Spirit, great idea!) most people seem to think that this forum is far more honest than usual (I haven't seen many other design forums, but if they are just circle-jerks then the design output will suck) - which I totally agree with. The only problem is being an asshole when it's not called for which I admit I'm guilty of at times (I'll leave it at that). Anyway, I'm glad to see new mappers because they extend the community's life and they tend to try things that aren't sanctified (sometimes bad, sometimes good). 

topic: has anyone done a q1sp/dm map with the deadmeat textures? they're up on the quaddicted wad archive, and they look nice and have a complete array of stuff (as well as looking great in the quake palette).
that could be a nice one maybe.

off topic: i think art forums get it more than most. you should see some of the 3d cg forums... sometimes you'll get a guy who's posting something that's complete crap and who clearly needs to spend a lot more time learning wtf he's doing and you get comments like "this is a great start, keep it up". i think comments like that are more damaging than helpful. in the cases i'm talking about, continuing on with a bad model is the worst possible choice. you'll run into all sorts of problems with bad topology and poorly planned edge loops/edge flow. starting over (as harsh as it sounds) is the best choice. you take what you learnt from your failed experiment and start anew with more knowledge. sometimes saying "that's fine for your first work, but you'll need to start over with more attention to xxxxx" is the wiser choice. 

When I very first started getting into any kind of computer graphics at all, I was pretty young, and pretty terrible. The friends I happened to fall in with online at the time were ... not encouraging, but almost patronizing, which I was of course too immature and young to pick up on. So I kept up with it, and eventually developed the ability to be self-critical and to strive for improvement on my own.

I think sometimes there's an effort in the art community to treat people the opposite of what they need, which I think is kind of necessary, because too much criticism early on can make an artist or designer overly defensive and encourage him to become set in his undeveloped ways too early. When someone is new and making lots of mistakes, tell them they should keep going, and when someone is a veteran guru, never say anything nice about their work ever again. It's not what their work needs, but it's what they need. It's not always simply about the output, it's about the confidence and growth of the person behind it. I think I like it that way, because too often people shit on those who can least withstand it, and fellate the egos of those who need a shot of humility more than anything else.

Ricky, you are a terrific mapper and you should never stop shining.