.. the solution is that people finish their map. I don't see any interest in starting a map, and never finish it: it is waste of time. 

FTW!! 

inounous, your 100b map weas not mediocre, you are WRRRRRRRRRRRRONNGG

and xen, I'd say your SoE maps were 50/50 - you certainly built the basic idea, theme, layout.

I agree however that the productivity to time invested ratio is fucking horrible. I've been trying to finish a few q1sp maps for at least five years. 

guess I should be more specific - ionous, I meant your 100b map was good, not just "not mediocre" which also leaves the possibility "horrible" open 

sure, i'm not gonna argue against that :) the problem for me though is that the creative aspect of mapping comes with making nice looking rooms and setpieces. connecting those rooms and setpieces into a full-blown layout entails less in the way of creativity and more plain toil, wherein the dreaded mappers' block ensues.. 

Why do you think people have so much unfinished map ? I think it is because they are mapping for fun, and if they find something more interesting, they switch to the "new funny thing", and forget they have already something cooking... whatever it is...

Well, I can't require people to not behave like this: we are mapping for fun, we are all hobbyists (most of us) and I understand there is no price at the end of the day for the work mappers are providing, except the self-satisfaction you can have when finishing a map and see players having fun with you "baby"...
Anyway, I don't like starting something, and never finish it. I act like this at home, office, and also for mapping... It is my own behaviour in front of a task... I didn't say it should be the case for everybody. I'm just arguing that it would be cool if mappers try to finish each started map, instead of being perturbated by lower game, just because they think it is more funny... It would result maybe in more quality maps, rather than waste of time and unfinished stuff, that could have been so cool to see the day of lights... though.. ;) 

the problem for me though is that the creative aspect of mapping comes with making nice looking rooms and setpieces. connecting those rooms and setpieces into a full-blown layout entails less in the way of creativity and more plain toil, wherein the dreaded mappers' block ensues..

Ok, so you're an artist, not a level designer.

Team up with a level designer and maybe you'll have more fun. Or take up modelling... 

release the maps as speedmaps :) "the unfinish" of course 

Awesome, I did actually think you were implying it was worse than mediocre, a charge I would not be able to argue with.

In retrospect, I do think the gameplay at least made the map interesting to play, which Aardappel seemed to agree with when doing the rankings. I do also like the distinction of having constructed one of the ugliest IKblue maps ever. 

i don't think the practice of unfinished mapping is that uncommon. i have loads of stuff i never finished. i have 2 q1 maps that i invested 3 or 4 months on each as well as 3 d3 maps with probably a year's worth of time altogether.

i look at it as both fun and practice. learning the workflow, finding better and more efficient ways to accomplish tasks and such.

for example, last month i wanted to do a little bit more complex scripting than what a normal map calls for, so i built a d3 map based on the movie Cube where nearly the entire map geometry moves and is governed almost by something that could be called AI. triggers send inputs to a main looping function telling it where the player is. it keeps track of where the player was and continuously decides what rooms to rotate/move and what areas to open and close off, as well as where to spawn in monsters. i doubt i'll ever finish it. :P 

why start something not to finish?

i dont see any point... :/

maby it�s just me...

i finish everything like it or not i dont give a shit 

The "problem" is most probably that many people here are perfectionists. And perfectionism makes progressing with one's work very slow and hard. 

i don't think the practice of unfinished mapping is that uncommon

Yes, I know, and I'd really like to see this "practice" disappear, and see less mapping loss and more releases ;) 

why start something not to finish?
i dont see any point... :/

Because some people have standards. Why release something that you KNOW is subpar? 

To get feedback you otherwise would not have received regarding how to improve it? 

Provide whining ammunition? 

or organize a visit to .NL (Amsterdam) for a weekend with drugs, alcool and grup sex with some nasty bitches?

:) 

 

hehe guess i drink to much at lunch time :) and had nasty drunk idears... i will repost in drunk threath :p 

"What Can We Do?"

Shut up and map. 

Just because you don't finish it doesn't mean there's no point to doing it. wtf? 

To Have The Pleasure Of Working On It Until You Lose Interest

exactly, it's not as if you start a map knowing you're not going to finish it!


frib: your reply to my post makes me regret starting this discussion, heh. i'd say i'm a level designer, i just struggle with some aspects more than others and have a short span of focus :) (with anything, generally, not just mapping!) 

Though the pleasure of having players actually enjoying a finished map is greater, there is still a great deal of personal satisfaction getting an odd piece of brush work to align correctly, or seeing an idea for a design motif actually work when you get it up in the editor. 

Although honestly it's not as if when I start something I'm just fuddling with brushes to see where it goes, I have plans and ideas and goals. I really should adapt more of a "what's the point if you don't finish it" mentality. I might finish more that way. :P 

:(

seriously, and i know this sounds cheesy, but it's more about the journey than the destination when i'm making something. if i get something finished that's more like a bonus.