Oula, you didn't offend anybody... Just check "SpaceHulk256 Mapping Competition (cancelled)" thread.... 

Better ai, vehicles implementation and gametypes are amatorial, they are not part of the game, they are external.

A game is composed from (for me, I'll never stop saying this, I'm not judging, I'm only showing how I feel about video games)

Models or sprites
levels
music
textures
sounds

The rest is external, if the game has bad models and a good graphic engine this does not mean that the game is a good game.

If I don't like the gameplay of a game, implementation of vehicles is usless, I will still don't like the game.

A better AI will not make a good game, if I don't like to shoot with the new Flack cannon I will not like to shoot neither a stupid bot or a smart bot. 

You don't have to like the game. It's cool if you don't, no hard feelings. I was just trying to make some sense out of your complaints which I have to admit it getting harder and harder with every post you add. 

 

 

OK, this is bugging me, wtf do you mean by amatorial? immaterial? amateurial? (I don't think that's actually a word, but etymologically it should be).

Also, just gonna circle and eyebrow raise here;

A game is composed from (for me, I'll never stop saying this, I'm not judging, I'm only showing how I feel about video games)

Models or sprites
levels
music
textures
sounds

So that's the art content (which for sake of convience we'll call 'graphics') which you feel is most important to a game. OK.

Better ai, vehicles implementation and gametypes are amatorial, they are not part of the game, they are external.

So that's the way the game plays in terms of believable opponents, weapon/vehicle mechanics design and gametypes (ie, the... um... game). For the sake of convience we'll call these 'gameplay'.


So from that we can deduce that you feel a game should be judged on 'graphics' only, regardless of 'gameplay'. While I can see where you're coming from, personally I would rather play something fun, regardless of art content (see Q1).


I know, I know;
If I don't like the gameplay of a game, implementation of vehicles is usless, I will still don't like the game.

But that seems to be contradicted by every other point you've made in your posts, so I'm going to have to assume that by gameplay you mean 'overall art style/direction'. 

I play UT3 here and there with friends. I really don't get why no one likes it, it's pretty fun and it's the closest modern game to the old school speed and chaos of Quake1 DM. 

It really is a great game. We had a ton of fun playing it during development. 

I really don't get why no one likes it

They herd it was bad 

I've been meaning to give it a go. I'm scared it's going to run like cack on my new laptop though.

Loved UT, more so than Q3 by a long way - got some wonderful memories duelling my brother in instagib, and out-sniping each other on that Morpheus level.

I didn't get into UT2003/2004 as much, but then again I never really had the time to invest in playing them properly. 

It runs surprisingly well on my 4 year old piece of shit.

2k3 was a terrible, terrible game (100% absorbion armour, brilliant idea ;)

2k4 was what 2k3 should have been, but by then everyone had already played 2k3 and even the rebate couldn't get them to take the same risk again. Shame. (I think UT3 suffers from a similar problem) 

UT2004 was wildly popular. 

208.43.15.242 is the ut3 server my tf2 group runs, usually Sunday nights we play. 

According to C-whatever, chess is a better game when you play it on your computer with animations, as compared to a board IRL! 

As a matter of fact quake1 is my favourite game in terms of models textures music sounds bla bla bla, it does not need a better ai or better engine, wich is a great engine it is only old. By the way, from where I come from?

The gameplay is not made by what you will use in a game, but how.

With the therm amatorial I mean that there is no concern about what the game is, only that the game has to have every graphical effect available and every game type possible in order not to be wrong and make everyone happy.

Chess? is it a video game? It's a board game, it does not have graphics, I'm talking about video games. 

UT(insertnumberhere).

Improved bot AI *IS* part of gameplay, it is a good thing. I always rated UT bots over other bots, less 100% reactions 100% accuracy bullshit (apart from at higher skill levels) and more random human like behaviour. Couldn't notice the difference in UT(n) but if it's there it's there.


New game-modes and vehicles - simply didn't like them enough to make them a good addition for me. One of the things that turned me off the series, too many bizarre vehicle modes getting in the way of fragging in cool enviroments. IMHO. 

This is the only online meaning I could find:

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Amatorial

Not sure if it really relates. 

"New game-modes and vehicles - simply didn't like them enough to make them a good addition for me. One of the things that turned me off the series, too many bizarre vehicle modes getting in the way of fragging in cool enviroments. IMHO."

We've always included DM maps for those who like simple killing. Don't give me your bullshit excuses, boy! Don't make me take off my belt. 

...so let's chat and make our points, no hard feelings.

"We've always included DM maps for those who like simple killing. Don't give me your bullshit excuses, boy! Don't make me take off my belt."

This is what I'm talking about: no objective in making the game, only let's implement everything, wich is a good thing if you simply whant to implement everything, but "implement everything" is not a good objective.

Improved AI does not mean "a bot miss you sometimes" means a bot will play in a more complex way to become umpredictable. But I want this from human players, not from bots! And you can always release a game and make it moddable, so users can make their own bots, it has been done before, right? I mean I think you can do this with every unreal and quake. Maybe now you understand what I'm talking about: AI is a technical issue external to the video game, I don't think it's a very part of the game.

Amatorial! ooops, I meant amateur. So I'll repeat my self.
UT programmers are amateur for the reasons above (objective in the game and so on). When I first saw UT3 I thought about Nexuiz, they are very similiar, but Nexuiz is free, UT3 is not.

"Don't give me your bullshit excuses, boy! Don't make me take off my belt."
Please Willem stay calm! why beeing so aggressive? If you are part of Epic well, I'm happy for you that the game and the engine are selling well, Shambler was simply making his point. 

 

That I see is the lack of theme variations in stock texture/mesh packages compared to the previous installments. I am seeing only 3 real themes: Japan, Modern/Industrial and Necris. 

"Please Willem stay calm! why beeing so aggressive? If you are part of Epic well, I'm happy for you that the game and the engine are selling well, Shambler was simply making his point."

I was kidding. I'm getting the feeling that you're not a native English speaker. Is that correct? Maybe that's the source of a lot of these misunderstandings. 

"That I see is the lack of theme variations in stock texture/mesh packages compared to the previous installments. I am seeing only 3 real themes: Japan, Modern/Industrial and Necris."

That's funny. We tried to give it a story with some sense of real of place this time around - so that's why the themes are limited. Can't win 'em all, I guess! :) 

...I'm not making sense, that's sad :( 

UT99, UT2k4 and Quake all share the same nice thing: they are a total mess of wildly different themes. While it may not be a good thing from storytelling purposes, it definitely makes a mapper's life easier as he has more to chose from.