Skin Limits
#301 posted by sock on 2012/04/28 10:07:57
Is there a desired format for the dimension of a Q1 MDL skin? Are they suppose to be powers of 2? I looked through some of the ID skins and they are all strange sizes, does it matter the size of the skin?
Skinsize
#302 posted by madfox on 2012/04/28 10:18:41
What Qmle concerns the skinfile compares to the first imported file from base. Sometimes it is square or rectangle. General is the with that considders to go to limits like 308 x 264.
I always scale this up to a factor 480 x (>480), as this is the maximum skinsize before Fitzquake stops the game.
There are other ways to obtain a larger file, which is just the same problem I'm struggling with.
I'm accostumed to qmle, and sadly this has bad UV wrappers, in fact not.
So as long as you use 480 x (the desired compare) you are safe.
Skinsize
#303 posted by Preach on 2012/04/28 10:50:27
The ID skins are bad examples to follow, as they were created before graphics accelerators existed. Graphics cards expect power-of-2 skin sizes. The way that GLquake copes with this is to rescale all the skins to the nearest power-of-2 size first, which causes some distortion/smearing.
Fitzquake does the more sensible thing and pads the skin with blank space to increase its size to the next power-of-2, but that's still a waste of texture memory you could have used for your own skin. So stick to the standard powers-of-2 approach for best quality.
Footnote: DOSquake has an extra restriction on skins, that they can't be more than 200 pixels high (although they can be as wide as you like). Since that would constrain you to 128 height, I'd advise just not caring that DOSquake can't load the file, I don't think it's bothered anyone else this side of the millenium...
Madfox
#304 posted by necros on 2012/04/28 19:03:37
external model textures go in the progs directory. make sure the engine you use supports external model textures, of course.
FYI
#305 posted by sock on 2012/04/28 20:29:44
If you are using noesis for model conversion, I found that if you have UV points on the edge of the skin they are corrupted when converting to Q1 MDL format. I have tried to contact the author to see if the program can be changed but not much luck.
#306 posted by necros on 2012/04/28 20:42:00
speaking of edges on the skin, and someone please correct me if i'm wrong:
make sure the top left pixel of the skin texture is not a colour that is used on the visible parts of the skin itself or black.
some engines replace the colour of the pixel in the top left corner with black and every other pixel that shared that colour.
or something like that.
Yup
#307 posted by Preach on 2012/04/28 20:55:56
It's like a bucket fill in 'paint', replaces the top left corner and all the pixels of the same colour which form a contiguous block. This has caused me a great deal of pain trying to figure out why a model I rendered with a single-colour skin was coming out solid black...
HR Resolution On Models
#308 posted by madfox on 2012/04/28 21:11:08
I can't make it fit. I have the HR texture pak in ID1/textures and the brushes appear well in Fitzquake085.
Now I have the model.mdl that I want to give a high resolution texture.
First of all the skinfile in QMLE is bound to 480x126 and 256 colours and named model.bmp.
I'm looking for a way to add the HR skinfile.
Placing the same skinfile on 16M colours in the texture directory won't help as I keep getting the old 256 skinfile.
I can change the name to model.mdl_0.tga with no effect
I can't change that as my knowhow of Max Gmax doesn't supply.
RTFM won't help a lot as I tried all I could.
What am I dong wrong?
#309 posted by necros on 2012/04/28 21:21:17
read post 304 again, model replacement textures go in the progs directory.
model.mdl_0.tga is the correct naming convention.
Wait
#310 posted by madfox on 2012/04/28 22:14:08
Let's explain more,
C:\Quake\ID1\textures is my HR dir, I changed it into
C:\Quake\ID1\progs\model.mdl_0.tga with all other HR tex.
My model.mdl is in C:\Quake\TmpQuark\progs with the progs.dat
In Quark6.3 I can go into game with the normal HR brushes but the model itself stays in the same 256 mode.
I know I'm going astray somewhere, but this problem holds me for a long time now.
#311 posted by necros on 2012/04/28 22:17:42
first, if you're working in a mod directory, you should put all your assets into that directory. you should never be adding mod assets into the id1 directory.
that said, what engine are you using? i know FQ and QS do not support external model textures.
#312 posted by madfox on 2012/04/28 23:02:08
In post #299 is a download model of a globe.
I use this mdl to create a turning skybox.
The model isn't perfekt as I still have the two poles having glidges.
So I'm restraining 2x 240 frames to get a perfekt turning skybox.
It's a bit fast, but almost compares the animating sky.
*v*
So it�s not excakt a mod, more an addon.
I�m using Fitzquake0.85 and in my ID1 is only the 2 Pak files.
C:\Quake\maps
.\textures
.\gfx
.\glquake
For this kind of work I compile in a subdirectory and place all atributes to the TmpQuark directory.
TmpQuark\maps
.\progs\
.\sounds
the recompiled progs.dat goes into the TmpQuark directory so I can test it from Quark6.3.So I wonder where I could place the model texture.
#313 posted by necros on 2012/04/28 23:46:10
I�m using Fitzquake0.85
That is your problem. FQ doesn't support external textures on models.
#314 posted by madfox on 2012/04/28 23:59:40
How do I obtain that?
DarkPlaces, JoeQuake, or what engine then?
No complain about Fitzquake, but I thought there might be a hack.
#315 posted by necros on 2012/04/29 01:35:58
i'm sure DP does, and i know rmqe does.
Fine
#316 posted by madfox on 2012/04/29 06:25:21
Thanks for your explain, it was usefull.
Me big ever smoking bluf for working in RemakeQuake and oversee that last one.
Sock
#317 posted by Spirit on 2012/04/29 11:32:16
I asked the Noesis author:
UV points aren't "corrupted" on the edge of the skin
The format just doesn't support wrapping
On Wrapping
#318 posted by Preach on 2012/04/29 12:35:59
Incidently, quake mdl format supports wrapping as long as you are willing to forego support for the winquake version! In winquake you get lots of random noise anywhere that the skin UVs leave the bounds, presumably because it's dumping random memory onto the screen. Probably if you abused it enough you would segfault the whole thing. So not the best of ideas but certainly possible...
@spirit
#319 posted by sock on 2012/04/29 18:08:45
Wow thanks, I tried to contact the author of noesis but I could not find any email address (none with documentation or website). I eventually found a forum site he uses but that is never speedy for responses. It certainly makes sense now that I know the MDL does not really like UV points on the edge, I just wish Noesis said something instead of just creating a mess!
Re: Neosis
#320 posted by necros on 2012/04/29 19:40:35
ijed, or anyone else using it: how are you exporting to fbx format? i'm trying to get it going with max9 -> .fbx and importing into neosis, but the mesh becomes all jumbled and the triangle count shoots way up for some reason.
Medieval Ammo
#321 posted by sock on 2012/04/29 20:21:46
Some new ammo pickup models I created because my new map is a medieval theme and I do not want tech style stuff hanging around. I know I am stepping on holy ground by redesigning the original models but I wanted something different.
Each pickup has an unique design profile so it can be recognized easily and I tried to keep the original colours as much as possible. The new models certainly have a higher triangle count, but I kept the original texture density. (I like the old style pixel way best)
http://www.simonoc.com/images/design/sp/q1_ammo_models_v1.jpg
Any likes or dislikes?
#322 posted by necros on 2012/04/29 20:31:46
mossy rock on top of the nails box is kind of weird? or at least it looks like mossy rock.
Like, +1 Etc.
#323 posted by Kinn on 2012/04/29 20:39:19
I'm a fan. I'd prefer them in gl_texturemode 3 tho ;}
#324 posted by scar3crow on 2012/04/29 20:39:45
I typically hate "new stuff" to Quake's look like that, but I oddly enough rather like those ammo pickups sock. I enjoy the use of the id1 textures as part of what is encasing them, makes them feel like more a part of the game world rather than items simply inserted by the mapper.
To Be Honest
#325 posted by Kinn on 2012/04/29 20:45:45
Changing quake's ammos from the fullbright bsp boxes to mdls that take level lighting, is one of the few changes that I would actually make to quake's original look.
I'd probably add some tasteful fullbright elements to the textures though, so that you can place them in dark areas and they don't get lost. Easier to do that with tech-themed stuff though...
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