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Posted by Shambler on 2003/05/11 15:08:47 |
I thought a trio of themed threads about other entertainment media might be good. If you're not interested, please just ignore the thread and pick some threads that interest you from here: http://celephais.net/board/view_all_threads.php
Anyway, discuss films... |
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#2518 posted by [Kona] on 2008/10/02 00:25:27
#1 because humans are too narrow-minded and don't want anything different to what they are used to. if that happens the rule it out straight away. americans in particular only want to watch american movies.
#2 we want to watch movies we can relate to ourselves.
i don't mind watching foreign movies with subs, but most less-avid-moviegoers hate subs. you get used to them pretty quick though.
Most Peopl E
#2519 posted by nitin on 2008/10/02 11:58:29
want to watch movies for fun, I'm sure no one disputes that??
So therefore, its really not all that weird that most people would rather watch a film in the language they understand rather than a language that they have to read to understand.
Dub It Then
#2520 posted by negke on 2008/10/02 12:31:59
Much easier and much less expensive than remaking the thing completely. Less intense too, but that's another issue.
And What About
#2521 posted by bamb on 2008/10/02 13:35:10
The Office?
I've seen a few pieces of both the British and the US version (I don't know how much the US version is a remake and how much it is just inspired by the original), both were good.
It can't be the language...
That Backs Up Nitin's Point
#2522 posted by HeadThump on 2008/10/02 18:03:54
after all, there are UK, US, French, German, Canadian (Quebec), and Chilean versions of the show.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Office
The British version only ran 14 episodes, and you need 23 for a standard prime time series run in the US, so mute point.
British Shows
#2523 posted by HeadThump on 2008/10/02 18:11:43
get shuffled to a station called PBS - Public Broadcasting Service. I don't know what is in on there now except for Upstairs/Downstairs (I think it still runs), and BBC nightly news report. I don't watch the station much now but I do recall as a kid watching Monty Python, Are You Being Served, Fawlty (sp?) Towers, and best of all reruns of The Avengers.
Shit On A Crumpet
#2524 posted by HeadThump on 2008/10/02 20:25:20
now except for Upstairs/Downstairs (I think it still runs)
I was thinking of Eastenders which does run on the local PBS affiliate. Upstairs, Downstairs reruns were commonly shown in the 80's but not I doubt if they do now.
What Headthump Said
#2525 posted by nitin on 2008/10/03 01:59:03
Despite being one of the funniest shows of all time, the UK office only had 14 eps. Now someone thought, we could make our own version of this, use the first 12 eps as a template and then just see how many (US) seasons we can get out of this.
Currently upto season 4 which is about 80 odd episodes so there you go.
Plus theres something to each culture having a different brand of humour so the the different versions all tweak it for the local audience. Whether they are superior/inferior is another question.
And Some Movie Reviews
#2526 posted by nitin on 2008/10/03 02:04:30
Under the Sand (2000) - one of Francois Ozon's better films, mainly due to a superb performance from Charlotte Rampling as a woman struggling to come to terms with an accident that befalls her husband. Ozon's direction is restrained and allows Rampling to carry an otherwise straightforward plot.
7/10
Nosferatu (1979) - I found this to be heaps better than Coppola's version of Dracula and mainly because Werner Herzog plays it as a gothic tragedy rather than campy horror. I guess if you're looking for the horror, you wont like it as much as I did, but the combination of some terrific imagery and a haunting soundtrack does still lend it an uneasy atmosphere. Klaus Kinski makes for an interesting Dracula, all tortured and self pitying, and with far more depth for this character than in any other incarnation of him I have come across. And when you add to that some good supporting performances from Isabelle Adjani and Bruno Ganz, you end up with a very satisfying if unconventional experience.
7.5/10
Paper Moon (1973) - not sure about Tatum O'Neal getting an oscar, but this is otherwise a pretty entertaining little film from Peter Bogdanovich. Set in depression era america, it's a road movie of sorts that deftly combines comedy and drama in the story of a drifter conman who takes his maybe daughter along with him when her mother dies. I hadnt seen Ryan O'Neal do much comedy before but he's pretty good at it, although everyone is upstaged by Madeline Kahn in a great little cameo. Also the cinematography by Lazlo Kovacs is brilliant.
7.5/10
Roman Holiday (1953) - went in thinking I wouldn't really like this and it is quite corny in parts but, in the end, Audrey Hepburn's charm just wins you over. William Wyler also makes great use of the location shooting in Rome. But it really is Hepburn that makes this work, tremendous screen presence.
7.5/10
Peeping Tom (1960) - released in the same year as Psycho and it's hard to believe that, although similarly themed, one film cemented the reputation of a great filmmaker while the other destroyed the reputation of its maker. Michael Powell went from Britain's darling to Britain's scapegoat with the release of what is really a great film. There's a few flaws, particularly the way in which some characters only serve the purpose of moving the narrative in a certain direction, but on the whole, its quite a complex psychological movie that messes with your head. Without getting into specific plot details, the movie follows, or rather participates the viewer in, the life of a murderous voyeur who is fascinated with his victims' dying expression of terror.
Every scene shows remarkable talent and is setup beautifully and if it wasn't for some convenient plotting and the flaw mentioned above, it would be an absolute masterpiece.
8/10
Forgetting Sarah Marshall (2008) - cant say I find too many of these Judd Apatow 'comedies' to be all that funny but some of them, like Knocked Up, do work as a dramedy. This one also has only a couple of actually funny parts (some of Russell Brand's line delivery is great and the Dracula rock opera is reasonably inspired), but thanks to Mila Kunis and Kristen Bell, it works to an extent as lightweight drama.
6/10 (just)
Cassandra's Dream (2007) - If Match Point was a return to form for Woody Allen, then Scoop and this make sure it was only a temporary return. Covering similar territory to his far superior Crimes and Misdemeanours, Allen makes a plodding film that, despite good performances from Colin Farrell, Ewan McGregor and the always reliable Tom Wilkinson, is just flat in every regard. The direction and writing are just downright bizarre, lacking any real energy and resulting in the whole movie feeling like a stage rehearsal rather than an actual film.
5-5.5/10
It Happened One Night (1934) - well now I know where Bugs Bunny came from. Clark Gable's inspired performance in Frank Capra's enjoyable screwball comedy had to have some bearing on the way that Looney Tunes character talked and acted. It helps that Gable has some great dialogue to work with but half of the greatness still comes from the manner in which it is delivered. The movie itself is excellent, with very good rapport between the cast, and only a slightly weak last act takes off a little bit of the sheen.
7-7.5/10
Ride the High Country (1962) - before Sam Packinpah started creating his own brand of Western, he paid homage to the old style John Fordish western with this movie. I much prefer Peckinpah and Leone's style of western than Ford's but this is quite a solid, well made if predictable and unremarkable film. Everything is of pretty high quality but in the end, this particular style is just not to my taste.
6.5/10
And Some More
#2527 posted by nitin on 2008/10/03 02:05:17
Straw Dogs (1971) - beautifully shot, superbly acted and extremely well directed film that is a psychologically complex, if a little confused, take on the nature of violence. That it manages to mostly achieve that without resorting to much on screen violence (although the scenes that are there are just as uncomfortable to watch as they would have been back on release) is a testament to Peckinaph's control over the material and Dustin Hoffman's acting skills.
The first 2/3 is a brilliantly controlled exercise in stretched out psychological suspense, so much so that when it eventually gives way to the visceral last 1/3, it does not quite gel as it should. Otherwise, an excellent film that at the very least will leave you thinking.
7.5/10
Young Mr Lincoln (1939) - its pretty hard to portray earnestness on film without getting too oversentimental and I find that John Ford usually is quite guilty of that, but this time he manages to do it in this 'biography' of Abraham Lincoln's formative years. I say 'biography' because it is definitely not historically accurate but as I dont really rate that as too much of a virtue, I had no real issues with this approach.
The film is fairly simplistic in its structure, you dont really learn anything about Lincoln and it is squarely in the iconography style of filmmaking which I do think limit its scope and impact if you are not american Still, its amazingly shot (some of the framing has to be seen to be believed) and Henry Fonda puts in a terrific performance and is the reason for most of the film's success.
6.5/10
Bad Timing (1980) - Nicolas Roeg's fascinating exploration of love, hate, obsession and memory will not be for everyone (some if it is quite uncomfortable to sit through) but its definitely a very worthwhile experience for anyone willing to go with it. Its quite simplistic from a plot and character point of view, the movie starting out with a man (Art Garfunkel) bringing a woman (Teresa Russell) to a hospital in Vienna after what looks like an overdose, and the rest of the film, through disjointed flashbacks bringing the movie back to that point.
But Roeg employs his trademark associative editing style in such a manner that the simple plot becomes a complex and very interesting narrative, although admittedly some of the impact is lost through a curious bookending of the movie with a police investigation into the events. Both leads are superb, especially Russell, in what are difficult roles, especially since neither character is really all that likeable.
7.5/10
Mike Leigh
#2528 posted by bambuz on 2008/10/04 03:52:12
an interview of him
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/Movies/10/02/mikeleigh.screeningroom/index.html?iref=intlOnlyonCNN
Now it all starts making sense why Happy Go Lucky had such special personalities and scenes.
#2529 posted by nitin on 2008/10/15 12:01:10
Little Caesar (1931) - solid if unexceptional old gangster film with the only notable aspect being Edward G Robinson's central performance as a Scarface type criminal which obviously laid down the template for many to imitate over the years. The rest of it is fairly pedestrian but Robinson makes sure that every scene he is in is interesting.
6.5/10
Iron Man (2008) - fairly solid comic book movie that suffers a bit from dodgy pacing at the start where it�s a bit too frenetic to successfully establish character and from an end that�s too anticlimactic. The middle section of the film is the best, where it deftly combines humour and action (the extended action sequence in the middle of the film is excellently staged). The cast is fine, although despite Jeff Bridges' best efforts, his character is a pretty weak villain.
7/10
Il Bidone (1952) - Although I'm not a huge fan of his later, more self-conscious and self-indulgent films like La Dolce Vita and 8 1/2, I quite like Fellini's earlier more simpler films.
This falls into the second category (despite an unnecessarily long and showy party scene in the middle which seems like a test run for the even longer one in La Dolce Vita), following a team of low level swindlers around the outskirts of Rome. It's not a con film, but rather about the people who have to resort to live this style of life. The acting varies from in quality but Fellini makes up for that by establishing and developing most of his characters through a combination of Nino Rota's excellent score and some very fluid camerawork.
7/10
The Day The Earth Stood Still (1951) - equal parts corny and impressive science fiction film from the 50's when concept mattered more than special effects. It will be interesting to see how the new remake turns out but I think its very likely that ideology will be reversed.
Although this version is considered a classic, I found it to have too many gaping plot holes and inconsistencies. But the central concept is interesting (spaceship lands on earth, everyone panics thinking its an attack and doesn�t realise the alien wants to communicate something, alien is attacked and assimilates into society, panic escalates etc), if awkwardly handled, and Robert Wise sets up his scenes very well and gets some pretty solid work from Patricia Neal (although hers is probably the only good performance).
6.5/10
The Ox Bow Incident (1943) - like a 'western' version of 12 Angry Men except that even though Henry Fonda again plays the moral centre of the movie, he does not take action as he did in Lumet's film. Which leaves William Wellman with a difficult task that despite his best attempts comes across as a bit too preachy in the final 5 min when the 'message' is literally read out to the audience. Till then, it�s a pretty fine film with tremendous atmosphere, a variety of interesting characters and great use of light and shadow.
6.5/10
Exiled (2006) - I've found his previous films to be lacking but Johhny To finally arrives with this one, a successful blend of the movies of Peckinpah, Leone and Melville. Eschewing the usual genre trappings of the asian crime genre, To manages to imbue his movie with a cinematic language that doesn�t require dialogue for communication, just mere gestures, glances and tics do the work. His characters say a lot without actually talking too much and To also uses this drawn out communication to ratchet up the suspense in particular scenes with minimal effort. As for the action scenes, they are some of the best in recent memory and also accompanied by a brilliant score.
I'm now actually looking forward to his upcoming english remake of Melville's classic Le Cercle Rouge.
7.5/10
Crimson Rivers (2001) - french serial killer movie with a plot so ridiculous that Agatha Christie would be proud. Matthieu Kossowitz seems to realise that his plot is silly and decides to try and distract you from it with some stunning imagery and finely executed set pieces. This ploy works well enough, as do the leads in Jean Reno and Vincent Cassel, but when the it all comes together you still end up forgetting all the good stuff and only remember the implausibility of it all.
5.5/10
Gar Brain
#2530 posted by mwh on 2008/10/15 12:21:34
I read "Iron Man" and started thing about the Ted Hughes story.
Nitin's review then didn't make much sense :)
Goddammit
#2531 posted by Spirit on 2008/10/16 10:06:15
I just finished the last episode of Cowboy Bebop. And once again a great thing was ruined by a super sad ending for me. AAAaahh!
You Should Stop Watching Anime Then
#2532 posted by Lunaran on 2008/10/16 15:31:34
they seem to be a fan of doing that
Spirit.
#2533 posted by bal on 2008/10/16 15:32:34
It's a sad ending, but it's not a bad one (which is most often the case).
Bal
#2534 posted by Spirit on 2008/10/16 15:36:55
Agreed, it is beautifully melancholic. I just prefer happily-ever-after. Well, gonna watch the movie soon.
Hmm
#2535 posted by bear on 2008/10/18 19:23:40
I seem to have forgotten the ending...
#2536 posted by nitin on 2008/10/22 10:35:18
4 Months, 3 Weeks, 2 Days (2007) - Palme D'or winner of 2007 and its not hard to see why. The premise is something like this : 1987. Romania is still under communist rule. Amongst other things, abortion is illegal. Otilia agrees to help her college roomate Gabita get one from a Mr Bebe.
That description might put a lot of people off straightaway but they would miss out on a stunner of a film. It doesnt touch on anything concerning the pros and cons of abortion, it doesnt directly touch on anything about the communist regime (although there is a fascinating amount of indirect detail), it focuses simply on a friendship and the strain its put through as events conspire out of control. Its an undoubtedly brutal experience to sit through, simply because of Cristian Mungiu's ability to sucker punch his audience through confident storytelling that heads off into unexpected plot turns which just seem to appear out of nowhere.
My only small complaint is that the film doesnt end as well as it should, although I'm hard pressed to think of a better ending personally. Maybe there was just nowhere left to go after what had come before.
8/10
The Petrified Forest (1936) - solid gangster film that is surprisingly filled with more ideas than is usual for the genre. But they're interesting and well articulated ideas, perhaps too well articulated as it descends into too much talk a bit too often but the characters are extremely well defined and the performances from Leslie Howard, Bette Davis and Humphrey Bogart are suitably strong.
7/10
Yuck
#2537 posted by Spirit on 2008/10/22 21:11:07
Tropic Thunder (2008)
Trash. I expected a nice popcorn hollywood comedy but it was much much worse (a kid leading the drug syndicate and stuff. And Jack Black of course.).
#2538 posted by nitin on 2008/11/02 03:48:50
Frankenstein (1931) - its a bit hokey thanks to some of the performances but there is unquestionable talent behind the camera with James Whale creating a very distinct atmosphere that suits the material quite well. Its also fairly short, which means that the hokiness only registers after you have finished watching it.
6.5/10
Bride of Frankenstein (1935) - the sequel seems to be as well regarded as the first film but I thought its tone was wildly uneven, switching abruptly back and forth between black comedy and 'serious' drama. Again, Jamesd Whale keeps it afloat really, with some nicely executed sequences that show good innovation.
5.5/10
Classe Tous Risques (1960) - seems to have been made simply to demonstrate that Jean Pierre Melville wasnt singlehandedly responsible for the french neo noir genre. But it's no mere Melville imitation, Claude Sautet's film being every bit as good as anything that Melville made in the genre, particularly in its dynamic and thrilling first half.
The character work is brilliant, and while the plot peters out a bit in the second half, by then you have experienced a little gem of a crime film.
7.5/10
Destry Rides Again (1930) - tongue in cheek western/comedy with James Stewart and Marlene Dietrich that is harmless fun without ever really being great in either genre.
6.5/10
Dragonwyck (1946) - gothic thriller from Joseph Mankiewicz in the mould of Hitchcock's Rebecca that is a bit of a misfire despite some stunning cinematography and an impressive performance from Vincent Price. Some of the plotting is extremely awkwardly handled and the movie's focus seems to be all wrong as well.
4.5/10
Grand Illusion (1937) - bit of a dated look at WW1, which according to the movie was the 'gentleman's' war. But Jean Renoir's misguided approach to the material results in a decidedly humanistic touch being lent to the proceedings, something that is sorely lacking from quite a lot of war films. That combined with his technical mastery (some of the tracking shots are unbelievable) make this quite a formidable film.
7-7.5/10
Leatherheads (2008) - the first misfire from George Clooney as director but the intent, to recreate the old Hollywood screwball comedy, was admirable.
Unfortunately the script lacked zing and Renee Zellewegger was cast opposite Clooney. I find her to be a terrible actress and she was completely miscast here resulting in not only a limp performance form her but also a complete lack of chemistry between her and Clooney.
4.5/10
Someone Was In A Halloween Mood
#2539 posted by HeadThump on 2008/11/02 07:45:16
A lot of those horror movies from the 30's played late at night on the local television affiliates when I was a kid. Amazing how many of them are still watchable today.
What If H P Lovecraft
#2540 posted by HeadThump on 2008/11/02 07:48:35
was discovered by Hollywood while he was still writing? One thing for certain, if they were made in the 30's the quality would have been higher than the few movies made of his work in the past few decades.
Headthump
#2541 posted by nitin on 2008/11/02 11:42:27
nah, just happened to be on top of the unwatched movie pile :)
I went through about 15 movies in the last week or so, those were just the first half.
And Talking About Horror
#2542 posted by nitin on 2008/11/02 11:43:18
anyone seen that new danish film Let the Right One In ? That's meant to be a cracker.
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