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ARCANE WIZARD
Just wondering if anyone is interested in a wizard/arcane themed q1sp project. The idea would be a common pak file, including a bunch of arcane monsters/props, and whoever wants to donates a map in an arcane theme (id wizard, contract revoked, ikblue, new texture sets, whatever). Then they get strung together, and that's the pack.

Criteria for arcane: in my opinion, there should be lots of books, heh. And a focus on signs and symbols and magic and such. contract revoked is a good example.

Anyone interested?
First | Previous | Next | Last
 
 
PHANTOM POST! 
 
 
Umm 
Damn, another one. 
 
 
 
 
Yet Another Missing Post 
I blame ninjas. Or perhaps pirates of some variety other than butt. 
No Two Missing 
:/ 
 
 
Tronyn 
i am still working my progress is just sloooow, my computer is f*cking up on me and i need to format and reinstall, but it is difficult when you work 80 hours a week....
i will have everything done tho so all entities will have replacements and i have made the custom monsters as well will send em soon hopefully 
Hey 
got your email, don't worry about it. For half of november and most of december I was too busy with school and then work to even touch Worldcraft. The models can be done whenever you have a chance. I've always considered this a "when it's done" project.

PS: FC, if you're still around, you could post here or send me a mail about what stuff has made it into the QC? If I survive writing this paper and a few other things, I just might think about starting to put monsters and such into my map...

cheers all around. 
Tronyn 
i am still working my progress is just sloooow

I can say the same thing. My map is about 50% ready (maybe 40%, it depends on how complex gameplay part will be). 
Tronyn 
I think I will need some more time to finish my map, I think of mid/late summer as a date of completion. Is that fine?

That's because I study in athother city atm and don't have pc there. Probably I will get it there, it will be clear in a few weeks. I'll let you know if it happens, then I could finish my map much earlier.

btw here's one screenshot of it:
http://quakemaps.nm.ru/screens/arc_1.jpg 
Pulsar 
Yeah that's ok. If you're going to take that long, then I'll definately be able to finish a second map for this project (no screenshots yet). It's the one inspired by Rogue's Towers of Wrath (as opposed to the one I've put shots of on on the site, which is a knave/ikblue textured thing). 
Btw Heh 
checked out the shot and it looks really nice!

I'll try to shoot for an update on the site within another month or two, with some more shots and info etc. 
.plan 
In between essays, work and ennui, I've been poking at the QC.

trigger_read still will not page past "page 1", and I can't figure out why; the code looks okay, for crying out loud. It might be that you could well be limited to Unreal-style messages - one small page of text. Yuck.

I'm also in two minds about implementing explosive shells. I can't see the point, and it's getting to where my brain hurts thinking about doing so.

So the feature list is as follows:
Weapons
* Chainsaw replaces Axe
* Chaingun
* Multi-rockets (need testing)
* Lava Nails (need testing)
Monsters
* Acolytes, Sorcerors and Warlocks
* Ritual Gremlins
* Axeman
* Rogue Wraths
* Zerst�rer Troglodyte
* Rogue Dragon
Environmental
* func_ladder
* func_bsp
* func_breakaway
* func_nodraw
* func_bspframe
* func_model
* func_tree
* extra keys
* master and slave fields for several entities
? trigger_read (still buggy)

These are described in more detail in the a_docs.html file in v0.9 of the resource pack, which is can be downloaded from http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/smile/betas/arcane_v0-9.zip

BTW: func_ladders rock. 
Hey! 
I didn't have 'net access for the last week or so, but this sounds great! Thanks a lot FC! 
On Exploding Shells 
i was thinking that a way to make them useful would be to make them use a different type of explosion than normal.

i'm thinking an explosion that deals very little damage over the same radius with less fall off than regular explosions.
so, something like
damage = 15*(100/dist);
if (dist < 100)
damage = 15;


anyway, the result of this is that it would be useful for groups of weaker monsters, but useless against more powerful monsters (which makes sense since these are shells after all) and won't overpower the weapon.

just some random idea. :) 
I Quit. 
Here's the source code and the start map sources and wad:

http://www.planetquake.com/fatty/smile/betas/arcane_source.zip

I have far too much to do right now with work driving me insane and other matters, and I do not see the situation improving any time soon. If anyone wants to try fixing up my loose ends, more power to you. (Tools included.)

More to the point, I simply have no interest in Quake modding any more. I have other infants to fry, and matters to pursue, and I'd best cut my losses where I can. 
Awww 
That's sad.

I put the frowny face icon to indicate the sadness. 
That Is Sad... 
but good job on releasing the source. Hopefully someone will pick it up and finish it. 
When Source Code Makes You Wanna Puke 
you know it's time to give up.

Now I have to knuckle down and start that fucking 3000-word essay. 
Shit 
i just got set up to start finishing the shit 
Well, 
exams are over within 2 weeks for me. After that I'll be getting into finishing this project, including seeing if I can get anyone to finish the code. Expect an update on my site early may.

Thanks for your work to this point FC, I appreciate the effort, not just on this but on other projects as well, and particularly SOE. Good luck in future endeavours, may they be more rewarding than just a bunch of anonymous guys on the internet thinking that you're cool a fleeting sense of personal accomplishment :) 
Bah 
...should read "and a fleeting sense of personal accomplishment..."
(hopes recent essays didn't contain similar omissions) 
Heh 
It's like your recent Feb 2004 site update ... 
Hey! 
How's this thing coming along? Still alive? D: 
Still Alive, Tis True 
Expect a site update (of the arcane site) by the end of the month.

Looking for someone to replace FC as code-dude. 
QC Police On Patrol 
If the project is still going/alive/speeding along behind the scenes, you might like to know that the following code fixes the trigger_read problem


void() read_touch ={

local entity stemp;

if (other.classname != "player")
return;


if (other.impulse == IMP_READ)
{
if (self.axhitme == 1) {
return; // leggo the key, dumbass!

} else {

self.axhitme = 1; // edge detection
return;
}
}

if (self.axhitme == 1)
{


self.count = self.count + 1;
if ((self.count > 12) || (self.count > self.cnt))
self.count = 0;
self.axhitme = 0;
}


if ((self.attack_finished > time) && (self.count == 0))
return;


// FIXME: Close book if the string in question is null
if (self.count == 1) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.message);
}
else if (self.count == 2) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.noise);
}
else if (self.count == 3) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.noise1);
}
else if (self.count == 4) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.noise2);
}
else if (self.count == 5) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.noise3);
}
else if (self.count == 6) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.noise4);
}
else if (self.count == 7) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.wad);
}
else if (self.count == 8) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.map);
}
else if (self.count == 9) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.deathtype);
}
else if (self.count == 10) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.model);
}
else if (self.count == 11) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.weaponmodel);
}
else if (self.count == 12) {
centerprint2 (other, "\n\n\n\n\n", self.netname);
}
if ((self.count == 0) && (self.attack_finished < time))
{
// alert player with sound cue
stemp = self;
self = other;
centerprint (self, " ");
bprint("Readable message\n");
self = stemp;
self.attack_finished = time + 3;
return;
}

else
self.attack_finished = time + 0.1;
};


Arrgh, the board swallows all the tabs, so it's an unindented mess. Should still work though, I have the qc file here in any case.

You will also need to add

void(entity client, string s1, string s2) centerprint2 = #73; // sprint, but in middle

to defs.qc just below the original centerprint function. Technically all the changes to the centerprint bits are cosmetic, they weren't the crucial fix. What they do mean is that the crosshair doesn't get in the way of the text. It's just possible that doing this will cut off the ends of long strings, if so, change it back.

So, anything else need doing? 
Preach: 
it's not the board's fault; HTML viewers are supposed to treat any sequence of tabs, spaces and carriage returns as generic 'whitespace' which gets collapsed into a single space. 
Preach 
maybe you could be the coder of the project since fat controller has left it 
Coding 
Yeah, I'd be up for that. I've got a lot of free time on my hands until term starts again in October.
So what needs doing coding wise? I know the trigger_read was causing problems for a while, but I'm not sure what else is needed for the pack. Is there anything in particular that the mappers need, like a monster that doesn't work right? Or is there a head mapper I should get in contact with who'll set me straight? 
Great 
the head mapper is Tronyn, you should contact him for more details.

As for what mappers need - it would be nice for me to include earthquake and lightning effects. 
Tronyn 
Is progs.dat ready? The architectural part of my map is almost ready. I think it's time for me to place monsters. I have a marksurfaces problem in my map, so I'll probably make a final battle in a separated map.

But I also have an idea that it would be good if we make all maps in progression one after other. I'm not sure if it will work, but I need hear someone's opinion. 
 
I can't use my own computer to edit anything right now, but my map has been at monster-placing phase for a while now. I think having all the maps in sequence would be a good idea.

Preach: Sorry I haven't been in contact, while trying to fix my mess of a computer I lost all of my email. An address that works for me right now is djg164@mail.usask.ca. Once Pulsar and I get some entities into our maps it'll provide a lot more ability to test/fix/code whatever with the arcane progs.dat. 
Tronyn 
What progs.dat do you use? I found that the one FC posted a long ago (v0.9) had a lot of unworking stuff. Some monsters don't work, my func_plats don't move etc. And there's no spawn fuctions there afais. And no earthquakes and corpse removal so far.

btw is it possible to make fgd file for these progs.dat? 
Hmm 
I'm placing entities (monsters etc) in my map right now, and I'll test how well it works with the 0.9 progs. I'll compile a list of things that don't work and then email it to Preach for fixing. Pulsar, you could do the same with the issues you mentioned.

An FGD probably isn't that difficult; I haven't made one before but I think I know how; I'll look into it. 
 
I'll compile a list of things that don't work and then email it to Preach for fixing. Pulsar, you could do the same with the issues you mentioned.

That sounds like a good idea. I'll do it.
So monsterspawning don't work? oh I plan a lot of spawning in monsters in my map.

And FGD would be great 
The Baron 
The Baron uses the DDZ base, with permissions, and EvilBastard is mentioned quite prominently in the Nehahra credits.

I must confess though I didn't have the experience with converting models in the skinmap department in 2000, so the skinmap was atrocious and the vertexes suffered degradation, which was a bit saddening as I'm a great admirer of Evilbastard's work.

I've already rectified that for the re-release and Ep4 though, and the baron looks great.

I had to comment because I took offense with the "rip-off" comment. I always give credit where credit is due and have no interest in taking the credit for other people's work, which is why there were so many names on the passive contributor's list. I am so conscientious of it that I am nearly anal about it and I see nothing wrong with using models that have free permissions if said models reflect what you envisioned in your head (though I am more often than not *inspired* by existing models, rather than inspired to create or find a model to match an image in my head). The alternative is trying to build a model just like it. Why rebuild something that already exists if you're free to use it? It would be silly to do so.

Anyhoo, pluck your turds out of my bubble bath :( 
 
That was in response to an old post #196.

But I couldn't let it go :p 
Evilbastard 
quality modeller, ratamahatta and hueteotl were another two of his I really liked. 
Good Luck 
i hope you guys finish this project some time, i still play the odd q1sp, and this is something i really look forward to. good luck guys! 
Preach 
Did you recieve my email? 
Troubled Times 
I just got it, my connection's been on the blink over the past few days. I'm looking into the problem, but not got anywhere yet. I don't think it's the problem mindcrime mentioned, it looks like there's already a second items field and all the flags look small enough. If you can come up with reproduction steps that produce this bug every time that would help me narrow it down. I've managed to reproduce it a few times when I run out of ammo with a weapon, but not reliably. 
AguirRe Has Suggested 
using the zerstorer spawn64 qc instead of hipnotic func_spawn, since it is faster and lightens the load for the engine. Since FC's progs don't have a func_spawn anyway (right?) maybe we could just forget putting those in and put in the spawn64 instead?

Update on my map: I've got all the gameplay (doors, buttons, routes, etc) done and am just starting to place monsters and items.

Kona: Thanks, long time no see 
Preach 
Nails are not collected at all. And weapons (NG and SG) dessapear when ammo is out. And not always disappear when I switch to another. 
Progress 
I believe I've got the disappearing weapons bug, or at least one of them, there was a flag being subtracted from the wrong field that was corrupting the items list when you took damage exceeding the amount of armour you had. It's possible other bits of code will be doing the same thing, so I'll keep testing.

The nail thing was also pretty easy to fix, and I'm confident that'll be ok. The wrong ammo icons might take a little longer, FC changed all the values of the item flags around, and that has an impact on the HUD, which basically reads the items fields for what to display. Do make sure you're playing it with -rogue though, that improves some things.

Afraid I can't give out the progs with these fixes, I'm posting this from a public computer as the network here has failed again. Nor can I download any source, which would help me get some things sorted. So in the meantime, what is spawn64? Is it essentially adding a spawnflag to a monster to make it teleport in when triggered rather than spawn at the start? That was what I was planning on doing, func_spawn seems a bit too much for most purposes. 
 
well, the basic idea of the zerstorer spawn function is that it checks if you've checked the spawnflag for it (can be 64, can be whatever) and then stops the code before setting model, movetype and solid values and the call to walkmonster (or fly/swim) (but after setting the .th_ functions). it also sets the .use to a function that completes the monster setup. so when the monster is triggered, the model gets set and it becomes visible, plays the teleflash and then goes to the stand animation awaiting to be awakened. 
Tronyn 
Update on my map: I've got all the gameplay (doors, buttons, routes, etc) done and am just starting to place monsters and items.

So we decided to make all maps in sequence? I remember you wanted my map to be the first one. Then you should keep in mind that player already has most of weapons when you place monsters. Right? 
Happy Day 
Ok, I can get internet from my computer now, so I've uploaded the latest progs. Grab grab grab:
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-11-10-05.zip

This is just a bug fix, weapons don't disappear randomly, and trigger_read works. Features like proper ammo icons and spawnflags for teleporting are on the way, but I figured getting something usuable quickly would be most beneficial. For best effect use the -rogue switch on the command line. 
Preach 
that's great. downloading now 
I Don't Have Rogue 
so monster_eel, all magi (monster_acolyte, monster_sorceror and monster_warlock) and monster_wraith don't work. 
Not Only That... 
But when enforcers die, they stay solid, and they spew out lots of backpacks, each pack holding 5 cells...

Oh, and some bastard removed impulse 12 as well... 
Today's Build 
Here we go, today's work.

http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-12-10-05.zip

You don't need rogue to get those monsters, all the -rogue switch does is turns on the new HUD graphics. I've included the updated gfx.wad from rogue in today's package, and since I'm so nice have even made custom icons for the chaingun and ammo : - ). The reason the monsters you listed didn't work was problems in the code. The wrath and eel had qc files all ready to go, but they weren't included in the build process. The mages didn't work because of a bug in the code, that occurred several times, but is an easy fix once you spot it.

Hadn't spotted the bug with enforcers, it comes about as a result of the rewrite FC did of all the monster spawning code. Gotta admit, the fountain of backpacks was lovely to watch. It's also been fixed in this build, enforcers now behave. What did impulse 12 do, was it cycle weapons backwards? Let me know and I'll fix it tomorrow. 
Very Nice 
magi work now =)

I hope you'll add last monsters soon. Also make func_train start to work (I think there's something with that 'master/slave' fields bug). And the greatest feature will be spawnflag teleporters.

btw who cares about enforcers in medival mod? 
 
the enforcers do. think of the enforcers. :( 
Lol!! 
If dylan sartain's around somewhere, I thought he was going to replace the enforcer models/themes with cultists. 
More Bugs: 
(btw, impulse 12 is cycle backwards, yes)

l_spike.mdl isn't precached.

Quake crashes when you try to cycle weapons while holding the lava NG.

There isn't a model for the chainsaw.

I get a multi-coloured blob instead of shell casings from the chaingun.

Sorry for listing so many bugs, but I tend to notice these things... If you need a fresh pair of eyes on the code then I can take a look for you. Feel free to contact me off-list.

LA

PS: Is there anything else I should get for testing this, apart from the progs.dat ? 
Bugs, Bugs 
Don't stop sending me bug reports, it's useful, not annoying! Most of the fixes for these things are easy, but I don't have time at the moment to both playtest the hell out of the mod looking for bugs and to fix them. Once I know there's a problem I can get straight on it. Like the lava ng stuff passed me by as it doesn't get given to you with impulse 9 - which I suppose constitutes another bug : - ).

Also, pulsar, which monsters are missing? Let me know and I'll try and get em into today's build. 
Heh 
Like the lava ng stuff passed me by as it doesn't get given to you with impulse 9 - which I suppose constitutes another bug : - )

I just assumed that that was a part of the weapon cycling bug...

The crash whe cycling from the Lava NG is a runaway loop - I have a crash screnshot if you want it.

I assume that the idea is to have the alternate ammo type show up on the status bar when using an alternate weapon, just like in DoE. I can't exactly remember how that is done, although poking around in the DoE source and DP engine source might help. But I think that you will need to pay attention to the variable names that you use. 
Preach 
Monster_ell and monster_wraith.

Also a minor bug - I get a message the fiend's idle2.wav is not precached everytime I see fiend (tho it's not idling) 
PuLSaR 
Have you got a map that I can specifically test this with? 
 
what do you want to test? 
Lava Eels 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-13-10-05.zip
Now contains everything you need for monster_eel. Monster_wrath was actually working yesterday, make sure you spell it without an i...wraith looks more natural to me, but the files and QC all spell it wrath. Same goes for the idle.wav bug, nailed that one yesterday : -).

On the lava_nails, it's less good news. The problem is that the lava_nailgun really hasn't been implimented at all yet, it's more like a bug that you can get at it when you pick up lava nails. The precache is fixed, but things are not all well yet, don't report bugs with the lava nails yet, it's just not done.

The even worse news is that half the weapon code needs changing to make lava nails work and the right ammo, it's a matter of replacing ammo_shells with ammo_shells1 everywhere(and so on for the other ammo), then adding another function in several key places, so a big job. Once that's done the upper ammo totals with be right and the other lava ammo bugs will be fixed. Not today though...

There shouldn't be a model for the chainsaw on the ground, it replaces the axe by design. And I get shell casings from the chaingun as normal, so if you've got any more info about why that's happening it you it would be handy. You aren't testing it in darkplaces are you? 
Another Bug 
If I open shootable doors with chainsaw the half of the way it opens with the speed I set in the 'speed' field and the after that it immediately drops into open position.

haven't checked the latest progs.dat yet, downloading 
 
There shouldn't be a model for the chainsaw on the ground, it replaces the axe by design. And I get shell casings from the chaingun as normal, so if you've got any more info about why that's happening it you it would be handy. You aren't testing it in darkplaces are you?

The chainsaw doesn't appear at all... You just appear to be holding nothing. I am using DP, but I woulldn't know what sort of errors I'm looking for...

@PuLSaR: I'd be looking to test monsters next, because there's currently nothing else to be tested on teh weapons. I can't map for shit, otherwise I'd just add the monsters to a basic rooom and test that. I can also test maps for bugs and stuff if you think it might be useful... 
Uhm 
And I get shell casings from the chaingun as normal

shell casings coming out of chainsaws isn't normal. 
Chaingun 
 
Lardarse 
Well I actually don't want to fullvis my map so far. If you want I may sent you fastvised version, but if you need just to test monsters I have a testmap with mothing but 6 brushes and monsters/ammo. 
Missing Models 
It sounds like you're missing all of the custom models for the game, do you have the zip file that FC posted long ago with all the models in it? The releases I've made are intended to be patches for that, not replacements. When DP can't find a model, rather than spit out a console error it replaces it with a default placeholder, which looks like a multicoloured diamond thing. I haven't done anything with bmodels yet, so I'll take a look at that door thing and the func_train while I'm at it. My connection is down though, so I might not be able to upload a patch today. 
And Again 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-14-10-05.zip
Here we go, fixes: Ammo counts now work, and the lava nails are in. Cycling forward is fixed, although multi-rockets might still break it. I'll do backwards once the weapons list is locked. The problem with non mastered/triggered func_trains is sorted. A few other cosmetic changes like reducing the number of idle noises from the chainsaw. Haven't been able to reproduce the chainsaw door bug yet, so it's still at large.

The new ammo code is the thing most likely to cause problems, if you notice at any time that the ammo on the top doesn't update correctly, let me know what you did so I can fix it. Lava nails should also be considered fully featured, so let me know about any bugs encountered.

If I've got this right, this is the list of known things that still need doing:
Fix chainsaw door bug.
Add teleporter flag.
Improve moster reaction time when waking up.
Add multirockets and exploding shells?
Backwards weapon cycling.
Anything else? 
Arcane_v0-9.zip As Seen In #359 
I think that backward weapon cycling has to be a priority now, if only so I don't have to listen to that bloody chainsaw starting up every time...

Forward cycling is fine, and it completely ignores the possibility of MR weapons. Ammo counts change correctly as well.

I have noticed a few issues with the chaingun, though. The weapon spins so fast that it looks to be convulsing when I hold down the trigger (I guess because of DP's model interpolation). The weapon is also far too powerful. It drops knights with 1 hit, and gibs eels with 1 hit as well. Also, it uses 2 ammo per shot, for some strange reason.

I am wondering if you are going to want reskinned lava guns, because they don't need those stupid warning arrows on... 
I Found The Source Code That FC Posted As Well... 
Now I understand why the Chaingun is so sick...

Preach, with your permission, I'd like to re-write the code for the chaingun to be less evil, less messy, and easier to balance once we get to that stage. If you've made updates to w_chaingun.qc, then I'd prefer to work from your copy. 
...and this here is the dangerous end... 
Be My Guest 
Only things I've changed in w_chaingun.qc are reducing the frequency of gibs spawned so it doesn't cause packet overloads when you unload on a zombie, and since the whole thing is a mess anyway, it might not be necessary once it's done. So yeah, just work from the FC version and that'll be fine. 
You Reduced Gibs? 
blasphemy! :o 
Gib Cuts 
The chaingun was producing three gibs per shot, it just wasn't feasible. Most things died fast enough for it not to matter, but zombies you can blast a lot of chunks out of before they die. One thing I thought of which might be important for rewriting the chaingun; quake doesn't like things that occur faster than every 0.1 seconds. You can do it, and it'll work a lot of the time, but it runs the risk of being very framerate dependent. The quake engine will ensure that there are at least 10 frames per second of game time, and will effectivly slow down the game clock if the computer can't keep up. There might be small fluctuations in the rate of firing depending on how the frames line up with the times, but you should always get 10 nails fired between time and time + 1.

If you do something with a shorter delay, say 0.05 seconds, a person who's only getting 10fps would only get 10 shots per second when they should get 20. This might explain why the chaingun fires rounds 2 at a time and then does two sets of damage in a burst, besides the slight benefits to the network updates gained by doing this. So it's something to bear in mind if you rewrite it. Perhaps the best solution if you want such a high rate of fire would be to check frametime each time it fires - if the framerate is below 20 fps, fire two shots and set the delay to 0.1, otherwise set it to 0.05. Bit more work though.

The other thing about the chaingun and model interpolation is that it only uses two frames, which for non model interpolation suffices to give the illusion of a rotating barrel. With modern engines it'll be obvious it's rocking back and forth, might be worth fixing that. I've got a good idea about how I'd go about this so it would look smooth on interpolating engines, but still look like it rotates in older engines, so I'll put it into the rewritten chaingun once it's done.

Positive news - fixed the door bug, and I've put in spawning by a spawnflag - 64 makes monsters teleport when triggered, and 128 makes them teleport in the same way, but silently, for doing reinforcments that have "moved into place". Can't upload it yet though, connection issues. Do people want multirockets? I never found them that handy myself, but the code is half there if people so desire. 
I Have An Excuse, Nitin 
idiocy, yeah, that's it. 
Agreed 
You Reduced Gibs?

blasphemy! :o


That is why I went ahead and built the gyro physics.qc patch into my basic Quake. The gibs are extra bouncy; the next step will be to get them to flop around and shake like jello. 
Replying To #468 
One thing I thought of which might be important for rewriting the chaingun; quake doesn't like things that occur faster than every 0.1 seconds.

Thought of that. It's averaging 20 for me when I test it.

The chaingun was producing three gibs per shot, it just wasn't feasible. Most things died fast enough for it not to matter, but zombies you can blast a lot of chunks out of before they die.

At 60 entities per second, I doubt even Darkplaces would be able to cope...

Perhaps the best solution if you want such a high rate of fire would be to check frametime each time it fires - if the framerate is below 20 fps, fire two shots and set the delay to 0.1, otherwise set it to 0.05. Bit more work though.

It's much easier and more consistent to fire 2 (or more) bullets every 0.1s so that's what I have planned...

The other thing about the chaingun and model interpolation is that it only uses two frames... I've got a good idea about how I'd go about this so it would look smooth on interpolating engines, but still look like it rotates in older engines, so I'll put it into the rewritten chaingun once it's done.

I noticed that as well. It's a shame really, because it's an otherwise nice model. If you're planning what I think you're planning, then it won't work, because there are other parts of the weapon visible, not just the barrels. I think that a model like the SNG would look best, but we don't simply want a reskinned model.

Do people want multirockets? I never found them that handy myself, but the code is half there if people so desire.

I will be able to comment on their usefulness a bit more after I actually complete DoE, but my early thoughts are that cluster bombs would be very useful (and more useful if they split up after hitting a monster). Multi rockets would probably be less useful, although they can clear rooms out very nicely. So yes, i want to see them. However, I think we need to limit the ammo on these. Maybe perhaps to 3/6 per box and maximum carrying of 50 ?

One last thought about the chaingun before I end this long post: Do people think that the knockback is too much? 
Preach 
I've finished re-writing the chaingun, all I have to do is send it to you. I hope you got my previous e-mail. 
E-mail 
Haven't been able to e-mail for a few day previously, but I've just checked them now and got the last message about the .meat field. So if you send it over today, I should be able to get it before the connection dies again. 
Np 
Sending now.

Btw: if you want a Gmail account, I can give you an invite... 
Less Talk 
More screenies 
 
I'd prefer more talk, more screenies, more things to test, more of everything! These times where there's nothing that I can do to contribute to this project are making me think about everything else too much... 
Patch Day 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-14-10-05.zip

Contained herein: The new improved chaingun code, thanks lardarse! Also, teleporting monsters, flag 64 for teleport when triggered, flag 128 for silent teleport. The troglodyte now no longer locks up when it casts the large explosion. Doors can now be opened by the chainsaw without jumping around. Maybe a few other fixes, I'm not sure.

So still to come is the enhanced chaingun animation and the multirockets. Maybe by Sunday... 
Re: #475 
Hey, I just released a Q1SP. Thought that'd keep you people quiet for a while :) 
Wrong Link, Preach... 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-19-10-05.zip

or just go to http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/ and select the file with the latest date. 
Well 
If people release things that require stuff I don't have it doesn't tend to keep me happy =/ More screenies! 
Preach 
another little buggy: i have a secret which is triggered by the the armor itself (it targets trigger_secret), I get the message and secret sound but the number of secrets I found doesn't change. It works in normal quake.

btw Tronyn: it's really a time to update the site with more info and screenies and maybe something more. 
Wtf? 
how fucked up is the source code that basic features like secret counting don't work? 
Metlslime 
normal trigger_secrets work as they should, while one secret with 'targetname' don't. I also wonder why. 
Chaingun Changes: 
The main changes are:

- Instead of using 2 ammo per shot, it uses 2-4 ammo per shot, but the shots are now a consistent 0.1 seconds apart, instead of an inconsistent 0.05 seconds.

- Damage was reduced from 40 per bullet to 20ish. but I nerfed it too much, so it's back up to 25ish.

- FC had some weird MultiDamage hack in teh code (as used in the shotgun code) which I removed to make the code be handed haster, and also because the gun is supposed to be firing the bullets 1 at a time.

- Recoil has been recuded by about 30%, and recoil in the vertical direcion is significantly reduced. I don't think that this gun should be non-damaging RJ replacement weapon...

Other than that. it's just cleanup. I'm sending an updated version to Preach in a moment, because I nerfed it a bit too much, and also because it's not behaving exactly as expected. But I'm happy with it.

Onto the bugs I've noticed. The slug ammo no longer decreases when the chaingun is firing. This is likely to be because of a change that Preach made to make it work properly in the first place that I didn't know about. Also, it doesn't display when you are holding the gold or silver key.

I think that's everything... 
Oops 
I kinda nerfed recoil but 60% instead of the desired 25% so I'm fixing that as well.

metlslime: lol 
Chaingun Revisited 
I had to make a few changes to the chaingun to make it compile, and while I was at it I fixed the ammo, so the patch released today has chaingun working at full capacity. I'll try and merge the file you send me so all the changes come through without breaking things.

metlslime - quite a few things have been broken because a lot of the code was rewritten before I got it. About half of the monsters use some extra functions and fields to reduce the amount of duplication within the monster code. To my mind it's kinda a wierd thing to do, it reduces the progs size, but at the expense of adding fields that take up just as much memory if not more. But the baron monsters would have to be completely rewritten from scratch to change that, so I'm inclined to fix the code that's there rather than scrap it all.

On the other hand, ths secret issue could just be a small conflict oweing to the addition of the master field. That's caused problems in the past.

Key icons I was aware of, but I thought I'd consult about them first. The code now offers many additional keys, copper, bone, things like that. So one solution I was considering was to get rid of all the power up icons(to my mind they're not that useful) and use those slots for icons for the remaining keys. Otherwise I could make it so just silver/gold keys get icons like before, but it's not very consistent. Also, with all those keys, things might get confusing - would having the key icon blink until you got it be helpful or distracting? The trigger to start the blinknig would be trying a door that needed a key and getting the "you require the obsidian key" message. I'm kinda leaning away from it now I've though about it, but I'll put it out there anyway. Any thoughts? 
Wow 
why on earth would you need that many keys? you'll need to code a keychain soon.


wow, that was terrible. o.o 
 
I hereby remove necros from the earth.
You're welcome. 
Use A Proper Fucking Compiler :-P 
Part of the problem with making it compile was probably that you're using frikqcc to compile it, and I'm used to using fteqcc. I think I have everything sorted out in the version that I will send you tonight...

Key icon blinking would be distracting. I know that there are now 7 keys available, and bar engine changes, it's going to be tricky to display them all. I would be inclined to do it, so that you display 1 of the key icons if you have at least 1 key, and display bth of them if you have more than 1. Then, use an impulse to (centre)print the keys that are being held.

Speaking of powerups, how many will this project have? I assume that there will still be the quad, the pent, and the ring, but what else? 
Black Magic 
I have a problem. It looks like spawflag64 teleporter has a bug - it crashes the map when I try to spawn an orge. I get a message:

EDICT 262:
modelindex 188.0
absmin '2079.0 -737.0 -1.0'
absmax '2145.0 -671.0 89.0'
movetype 4.0
solid 3.0
origin '2112.0 -704.0 24.0'
classname monster_ogre
model progs/ogre.mdl
frame 1.0
mins '-32.0 -32.0 -24.0'
maxs ' 32.0 32.0 64.0'
size ' 64.0 64.0 88.0'
use monster_use()
health 200.0
takedamage 2.0
view_ofs ' 0.0 0.0 25.0'
flags 544.0
waterlevel -1.0
watertype -1.0
yaw_speed 20.0
spawnflags 128.0
targetname door4t
noise ogre/ogwake.wav
th_stand ogre_stand1()
th_walk ogre_walk1()
th_run ogre_run1()
th_missile ogre_nail1()
th_melee ogre_melee()
th_pain ogre_pain()
th_die ogre_die()
mdl progs/ogre.mdl
pausetime 100000000.0
hmodel progs/h_ogre.mdl
Host_Error: PR_ExecuteProgram: NULL function


And I haven't checked it enough but it seems like func_wall's invisible mode (spawnflag 1 doesn't work properly).

Also I feel like this mode has really a deal with black magic: something strange happens to my editor, it goes crazy. Objects' properties change somehow without my help, entities turn from one to another... err I hope that's just a bug that won't return after I restart my editor. But if not..
Preach are you sure you didn't use voodoo or something working with your progs.dat? 
 
And I had a crash saving the game the other day, but I haven't tried to repeat it since. Can anyone else look into this? 
Hot Off The Presses And Right On Time 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-20-10-05.zip

V2 of the chaingun is in, the code pretty much worked straight off, which is good. I also altered the model and the animation frame code so it works much better with interpolation, while maintaining the same good behaviour on normal engines. There's even a cooldown animation when you stop firing!

The teleporter crash is fixed, I thought I'd got it once before, but now I've got it figured out much better. I blame all the rewrites, with the normal ID code it's twice as easy to impliment the teleporting. Speaking of rewrites:
/*==================
T_SECRET: Secret Trigger

This file's an experiment to see if it's possible to split
the trigger_secret's code from the trigger_multiple.
====================*/

Yeah, I'd not seen that before, so now the secret trigger is fixed if you pick up an item that targets one.

I don't get what you're saying about the func_wall though. In the original ID code there's no spawnflag 1 behaviour written, and the code hasn't changed here. If it's a feature you need tell me what it's meant to do and I'll add it.

And I can't do anything about the editor or saving problems, both of those are out of my hands. Ah well, G'night all. 
Well 
from FC manual to this progs.dat:
The following brush entities have extra functionality added as described below.

3.3.1. func_wall

The following spawnflags have been added.

1: "Invisible": The brush model for the func_wall will not be drawn.
2: "Toggle": The func_wall can be toggled "on" (drawn and blocking) and "off" (not drawn and non-blocking). When used in conjunction with the "Invisible" flag, one can have something like a forcefield.


Donloading latest patch... 
Don't Worry, I'm Being Punished 
Whoever invented Morrowind's scripting language will surely burn in hell. 
Guns Are Good, Now 
Now I want to see some maps to test... 
The Day Today 
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-21-10-05.zip

Stuff:
*Func_wall now has those spawnflags
*Cycling weapons backwards added
*Enforcers will now actually fire at you
*Big optimisation on the AI overhead - essentially when monsters weren't attacking they'd call walkmonster_start_go every frame, which would then call the stand/walk think function, along with resetting all the default settings in walkmonster_start_go needlessly. This has been corrected, now monsters think their function directly after the first walkmonster_start_go. Funnily enough, this would have fixed the teleporter crash from yesterday as well...go figure. I think it's also fixed a rare AI bug where monsters who were mad at other monsters would become trapped in a run cycle and never attack, but since it's hard to replicate I'm not sure of this. 
Preach, 
It sounds like a heroic effort.

Fat Controler -- come on back to Quake if Morrowwind is wigging you out. The new Nehahra when it is released will certainly give you some interesting things to play with. 
Pulsar, Preach, Lardarse 
you guys have mail 
Preach 
Some more bugs:

Spawflag64 somehow doesn't work for spawning custom monsters (at least monster_sorceror/alcolyte/warlock). I didn't check the others, but these ones definately don't want to teleport. They even don't disappear in the beginning.
Also scrags behave themself strange after spawning. They don't just hang where they were spawned, they begin to move in strange directions. I'll dig more about it sooner.

And invisible func_wall doesn't work for me even now. 
Post #500 
oh Preach

I've just found that i used not your latest patch. Func_wall works as it should. Thanks.

But:
The game now crashes again when i try to spawn fiends and scrags (and maybe orges) with the similar message. Tho everything worked fine it your previous patch.
Magi still don't spawn.

message:
EDICT 272:
modelindex 213.0
absmin '1535.0 -305.0 255.0'
absmax '1601.0 -239.0 345.0'
movetype 4.0
solid 3.0
origin '1568.0 -272.0 280.0'
angles ' 0.0 25.0 0.0'
classname monster_demon1
model progs/demon.mdl
frame 1.0
mins '-32.0 -32.0 -24.0'
maxs ' 32.0 32.0 64.0'
size ' 64.0 64.0 88.0'
use monster_use()
health 300.0
takedamage 2.0
view_ofs ' 0.0 0.0 25.0'
flags 544.0
waterlevel -1.0
watertype -1.0
ideal_yaw 225.0
yaw_speed 20.0
goalentity entity 274
spawnflags 65.0
target cou_trm_3
targetname mon_tel_trap_1_3
noise demon/sight2.wav
th_stand demon_stand()
th_walk demon1_walk1()
th_run demon_run()
th_missile demon1_jump1()
th_melee Demon_MeleeAttack()
th_pain demon1_pain()
th_die demon_die()
mdl progs/demon.mdl
pausetime 100000000.0
movetarget entity 274
hmodel progs/h_demon.mdl
Host_Error: PR_ExecuteProgram: NULL function
 
Ya Bastard 
I wanted post 500 
Internet Outages 
Can't connect my comp to the internet again, patch forthcoming as soon as it does(and I get this backlog of maths work done...)Mages didn't have the teleporting permitting code in, they do now. As for scrags, I've spawned them fine with the current patch, maybe the fix for ogres broke fiends. I'll look into it. 
 
Preach are you still alive? 
I'm Here 
Finally got the connection back today, so here's the patch before it breaks again.
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-27-10-05.zip
Fixes teleporting monsters, although I still don't see what's wrong with scrags, unless you're trying to make them patrol after they teleport in. Not sure how well that will work if you do. If you really need it, I'll look for a fix.

Also a few balance tweaks, tidied up the chaingun animations some more, key icons now work(or did they last patch?). Putting icons for the other keys in would take a rewrite of how the powerups are done, but since nobody seems to need the feature it's probably not worth investing time in. Ok, have fun! 
Preach 
Who of these guys is the weakest: Acolytes, Sorcerors and Warlocks?

Biw is it possible to make something like "magic" visual effect? I mean kinda fluids in the air, permanent and temporary. For example I want to make the effect of magic crated bridge. When player presses a button the bridge moves from the space outside of the map to where it should be (with speed 1000), but plater doesn't see it. Then player teleports back (after a few seconds) and sees the bridge. I want this bridge to be covered with that 'magic' effect for 5-7 seconds.
Or another example. There's a place of rituals in my map. When player enters that room he sees that place surronded by mages (they are summoning someone there). There should appear that magic effect. Then player kills all those mages, but ritual as already made. Magic effect stays after their death. And after a few seconds a big bad monster spawns in that place.

Is it possible to make something like that? I remember forcefields in base maps. Maybe it could looks something like that but with different color and not plain. 
 
dunno what "fluids in the air" means and "magic" isn't very descriptive XD, but if you want, you can use the hip code that makes particles and simply make those flash for a bit. 
Tronyn 
Did you recieve my emails? The only I replied you recently and the one I sent you a few weeks ago to your netgames address. 
 
only=one 
Through The Looking Glass 
Even though my connection is technically broken, I've found a way round that to upload today.
http://people.pwf.cam.ac.uk/ajd70/progs-30-10-05.zip
Two changes. One is to do with acolytes and warlocks. The hierachy of mages is meant to go acolytes < sorceror < warlock. Unfortunatly a bug/feature meant all acolytes were being turned into warlocks anyway. Been fixed now, but it means monster_mage now defaults to acolyte rather than warlock.

The other change is a quickly hacked together entity you might find handy for that magic effect. It's called misc_magic, and it spawns the effect from the troglodyte magic. Parameters are:
count - duration in 10ths of a second
weapon - colour of the particles
lip - radius of the circle
Just target it to set it off. I dunno if it'll actually do what you're after, but on the plus side it was only 10 lines of code. 
 
For those of you who don't know, these new mages can use any weapon their underlings can. You can set the rank of a monster_mage with a count between 0 and the default of 2, or use monster_acolyte, monster_sorceror and monster_warlock entities.,/q>

count should default to 0, yes? 
Exactly 
Default for count is 0, but there was a lump of code that changed count to 2 any time it was 0 or greater than 2. presumably so that when you made a default monster_mage it became a monster_warlock. Which is well intentioned in itself, but the problem is monster_acolyte just calls sets it's own count to 0, then calls monster_mage, so you get in a mess. Only reason I mentioned it was if people had used a monster_mage already, expecting it to default to monster_warlock as it had been so far, they'd need to alter it to make it the correct level. 
Bump! 
Given the essentially infinite number of these entities you can use and the consequences of them firing at targets, any start/hub map type functionality can be implemented. You could even have the start map fill with monsters once the rest of the maps have been completed.
(From Quoth mapping tutorial, about info_endgate and info_mapgate)

Wasn't it our plan to have the stsrt map invaded by monsters once the other maps had been done? Do we still want to do this? If so, is there any chance that we can co-ordinate with Necros and Kell to have this as a feature? 
Monsters In The Start 
If it's needed, it'd probably be easiest to add it directly. The ammount of rewritten code in the arcane progs means merging things from other mods is often just as involved as writing them from scratch. I'd probably just go with adding another spawnflag like the teleport flags, which removes the monster if a value isn't set, and a corresponding option to set that value on trigger_changelevel. Seems easier, since it's just a single monsters on/monsters off situation. 
Yes 
Monsters in the start map is basically what I wanted.

The thing is though, we could just use two different BSPS - as the maps will be played in a linear order, the final map could just link back to a different version of the start, containing monsters etc. 
Linear Order? 
That's not how I imagined this to go...

My idea was that you have a start map which is a hub to 3 arcane-themed maps. Once you have done those, a door opens to a more evil area that willl lead back to the variant base map.

Of course, you are the project leader, so it's your call... 
Well 
Originally, Fat Controller wanted the start map as a sort of a "hub" to several other maps.

But lately Pulsar suggested having the maps in a linear order, which I now think might be better. We are kind of thinking of having a thematic progression in the maps, which would make more sense if they were in a set order.

But it's not set in stone.

Btw if I don't have a beta of my first map ready by December then someone shoot me. 
Oh, And 
if I haven't updated the project's web site within a week then give me the same treatment. 
Which Weapon? [nt] 
 
An Uninformed Opinion 
make it have some kind of structure, not just a hub where you can do maps in random order and start with shotty in each. That isn't so great imo. 
I'm Taken Away 
I have to leave tomorrow. Not to leave the project but leave my home and pc until february.

My knave map is about 1-2 weeks to be finished (beta) but I was called today and told that I must go tomorrow. In fact I should have left in august-september but (fortunally for this project, unfortunatelly for me) I'm leaving only now.

I'll come back soon and finish my map and make a new one. I hope Tronyn will finish something when I return :)

See ya, guys. 
 
make it have some kind of structure, not just a hub where you can do maps in random order and start with shotty in each. That isn't so great imo.
Who said anything about resetting the weapons between the maps ???

PuLSaR: Good luck, whatever it is you have to do... 
Well 
have luck balancing combat if you don't know what weapons the player'll have. 
Tronyn Et Al, Re Post 516 
IMHO:
linear order > hub.

bye! 
Fair Enough... 
So we have a start map, 3 arcane maps, an evil map, and a final map where your library gets invaded. Sounds good... 
Source For Baron 
Hello everybody can somebody sen me into mail email rpature�s baron qc code please.My mail is testtesttest@seznam.cz
Please help me!!!! 
Tronyn 
Your time is up...

Btw if I don't have a beta of my first map ready by December then someone shoot me. ... Oh, And if I haven't updated the project's web site within a week then give me the same treatment.

I'm coming for you with my chaingun... 
Oh Shit 
It's up! It's up!

as usual, http://www.planetquake.com/tronyn/arcane

Main thing on the page is that I'm looking for *one more mapper.*

My beta will be ready in december; maybe two beta maps, actually.

Then I can start building the library/cathedral/mansion/university or whatever setting it is on earth. 
 
... and the humorously named Lardarse ...

That's one way of looking at it... 
Tronyn 
That header graphic makes the page wider than 1024. 
Lol 
well the entire page is shit, so I think I'll keep it that way on principle :) 
Tronyn 
FYI

There are broken links in the Development, Textures and Prefabs page. They are:

- Contract Revoked Textures and Others link
- Prefabs related link

;) 
Tronyn 
is there any progress with this project?
I'm back with pc, but I'm in another city right now and i don't have the source of my map atm.

but i'm ready for betatesting or anything so feel free to e-mail me

btw i'm i'm drunk right now because i've past my last exam 
Welcome Back! 
And grats on finishing your exams. Go enjoy getting being drunk :-)

I'll send an e-mail out to Tronyn and Preach to see if they still remember this project. I think the coding side is done, it's the mapping that needs doing :-/ 
My Email 
is now djg164@mail.usask.ca
in case either of you is still using my old one
expect an email frome me soon also
I'm about to start exams too, so the drunkenness for me is coming in a couple weeks, heh 
Well, That's 3 Of Us... 
Where's Preach?

And more importantly, Tronyn...

My beta will be ready in december; maybe two beta maps, actually.

Where the fuck are your map betas? 
I'm Here... 
However, next term I have a ton of exams to revise for. So if there's anything that urgently needs coding it'd be best if you said in the next two weeks or so. 
Well 
I used aguire's engine for testing my non-fullvised map and I missed the fact that I got over the edicts limit. I think corpse revomal should be employed to these progs.dat 
TRONYN 
Are yoU stiLl aLivE? 
 
his drunkenness lasted longer than expected 
Bump 
hows the arcane project going fellas? i feel like having a game :) i need my annual quake-fix 
Arcane 
project is going fine. slow but fine. 
Going Fine? 
Then send me something to test... 
Ok 
Just an update to explain what's going on. I'm in graduate school right now and just got my PC working again a few weeks ago, I had to replace the video card, which sucked. I had hoped to finish and release _something_ in August, but the month just flew by with me being in a few different cities and then moving. September also flew with getting into school and starting work marking papers and etc. Anyway, I'm set up again.

I have a beta of map 1, but I want to try out a storm effect in it. I did this a long time ago in my map Storm Dungeon, but that was so long ago (5 years or more) that I can't remember exactly how I did it, and the example Storm map that I used (on the Forge) doesn't seem to be there anymore. Does anyone have that map, or know how to do this?

I just need to fix that up and fullvis it. Gameplay is really hard, and using the chaingun is fun. 
Storm Effect 
By that, do you mean the light levels occasionally flickering like lightning flashes? Because that can be done relatively easily with a bit of custom code. The one technical snag you may encounter is if you want light cast from skybrushes( _sunlight etc) to flicker - kinda natural desire when you think about it. The problem is that sky cast light is always lightstyle 0, so you have to flicker all lights that don't have a style set.

The simple workaround is to define a new style with the same light level as style 0, and then use that style for any indoor lights that you don't want to flicker. You can then make style 0 change light levels at random with some code in StartFrame. The code should also be opt-in based on some worldspawn key so that all the id maps etc. don't start flickering indoors. 
Kind Of Like That 
all I want is a bunch of randomly triggered lights, with thunder either simultaneously or following shortly afterwards.

I'm not using skylight in this map. Although I usually do use skylight, and like the effect greatly, this is a mostly indoor map. I've just placed really bright point lights inside all the windows. 
Well 
I'm still alive too. I spent previous 3 years moving from one city to another every 2-3 months and had no permanent internet access. And yesterday I finally returned back home. So everything's fine. I have a third beta of my map almost ready. 
Tronyn 
You could try a lightstyle applied to a local minlight - standard point light with delay 4 (aguirRe's light tool). Which makes it without falloff.

For the custom flicker I'm not sure if any of the basic ones would look any good for occassional lightning, so you might need a progs change for that, since you'd want it to be dark / off 95% of the time.

It was a cool effect in Storm Dungeon, even though the Shambler Baron was a pain in the nuts. 
Hmm 
Is there a code entity that randomly triggers its target keys? I'm pretty sure that's how it was done in Hipnotic. It could just toggle the lights on and off.

Also, Preach I noticed while playtesting that in the progs there's an occasional bug with projectiles, where they get "stuck" at a stationary point and don't explode. Have you seen this, or have any idea what causes it? 
Hmm 
Can't say I've encountered that, no. E-mail me the details and I'll look into it, especially helpful if you can save a game with the bug reproduced and send it to me. I'll fix that and add the lightning code at the same time. 
Still Here And Available For Testing 
That soudns like a bug I'd only see when playing online... 
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